[07stanggt]

Dyno's are real world testing. Ok, so go to kooks site and watch a video of JDM dynoing a saleen blown car and picking up 40rwhp. Is that neglible, or is KOOKS dyno false? Where KB's dyno is real. If KB didnt pick up hp with headers on a blown car they are morons. Come on man are you reading what you are typing? By the way the 40 hp is BS but thats not the point.,r.

Did it ever dawn on you that PROVING what blew an engine isnt always possible? I can show you plenty of pictures of blown engines that were running BAPs. We have one in this thread.


You are on here saying headers dont gain power becuase KB said so and telling people THEY need a education or they got "sold by tuners"

[DiMora]

Originally Posted by 07stanggt Dyno's are real world testing. Ok, so go to kooks site and watch a video of JDM dynoing a saleen blown car and picking up 40rwhp. Is that neglible, or is KOOKS dyno false? Where KB's dyno is real. If KB didnt pick up hp with headers on a blown car they are morons. Come on man are you reading what you are typing? By the way the 40 hp is BS but thats not the point.,r. Did it ever dawn on you that PROVING what blew an engine isnt always possible? I can show you plenty of pictures of blown engines that were running BAPs. We have one in this thread. You are on here saying headers dont gain power becuase KB said so and telling people THEY need a education or they got "sold by tuners"

I never said that headers don't gain power. KB said that...sort of. I KNOW that headers make power...I've seen dyno charts that prove it.

Here is what KB said. Don't beat me up, beat KB up.

"Headers? 4 tube or Tri-Y? 4 tube headers work best, but even they offer very little HP gain on the late model vehicles - and they are expensive! We've never seen any worthwhile gains on the 4.6, 5.4 Fords - certainly not the inflated numbers we see advertised. Just look at the reputable tests by MM&FF magazine. "

They also say this:

"How do I determine if there is any HP potential in the exhaust system? Again, if you don't have a flow bench and the historical data for analysis, try another Kenne Bell approach. Cut off the entire exhaust in back of the catalytic converter and compare the runs on the dyno. You should also measure back pressure. If there is a gain, then you have to design - or find an exhaust system that can flow as much air as no exhaust system. As we've mentioned previously, there's not much HP left in the new vehicles, particularly the Fords, Chevies, Dodge 5.7, etc. That's exactly why supercharging has become so popular - the HP is guaranteed."

That is clever wording IMHO...read it carefully. They say "Aft of the cats"...that implies keeping the factory headers and factory cats, does it not? Where I think we make power with longtubes is the combo of the longtubes with aftermarket high flow cats into an X or H. That whole topic is really for another thread...this discussion is about fuel pumps.

My "education" point is people bash the BAP and they haven't even read how it works, that is all.

The engine that blew in this thread didn't blow due to BAP failure. It failed due to Meth injection failure causing vapor lock:

Originally Posted by 2006greyGT I run the BAP with 545 rwhp... well I should say I did run it... hey I will sell you mine if you want... I had meth injection that fucked up and I spun another rod bearing due to a vapor lock.. I am going with the GT500 pumps because I intend to be over 650 with a 100 wet shot.. give you a good deal on it an help me with the cost of my pumps... never had an issue with the bap setup.

Yes, I know you cannot always prove what blew an engine.

Some folks do get sold by tuners. Customer needs more fuel. Tuners want to make money. Selling and installing a set of GT500 pumps is a great way for them to make money. $700 + installation. They make little to no profit on a BAP. A BAP is $240 and you can install it yourself. It's one wire you cut. Example: One tuner told me I would NEED GT500 pumps when I added my TVS blower. That particular tuner doesn't do TVS tunes with a GT pump / BAP combo...only a GT500 pump setup. Maybe that's because they have seen too many blown up cars with fried GT pumps and charred wiring. <---Note sarcasm. I chose a tuner that tuned with my BAP installed.

Buy what makes you happy...I'm doing BAP for now (since I already own it) and GT500 / Dual BAP when I forge. I'll PM you for a price on GT500 pumps when that time comes.

[07stanggt]

No worthwhile gains with headers. Worthwile is a subjective term as guess. That whole header comment they made is downright stupid to me. And the second paragraph is not even about headers its just about seeing if the stock exhaust is restrictive. Power from headers isnt a restriction issue anyway.

Whatever on the BAP. I would get a GT500 pump, thats just how I look at it. does grey know for 100% what happened and if so how?

On the profit issue. Let me explain this. Just becuase something cost 699 doesnt mean you make a lot of profit on it. The overall cost of a product has almost nothing to do with how much profit a dealer/shop/ would make. The pricing structure you fall in with that company is what determines your profit. And manufacturers differ greatly on pricing structure or levels.

I can tell you that I would make more profit selling a set of $240 lowering springs from BMR then I would make on a FRPP gt500 fuel pump. And I dont mean more profit as a percentage, I mean more actuall dollars in profit. Is that everybody, probably not, but it cost a lot and you have to sell a lot to get direct pricing from ford racing. Very few shops and certainly very few small TUNERs are direct with FRPP. You got 50 grand to buy in with them? Thats the only way you are making good money selling frpp stuff. Just a common misconception i thought i would clear up for ya.

Some shops might just have a different reason for not playing around with fuel delivery on blown cars.

[DiMora]

I agree with you 07...I think KB's header comment is stupid as well.

[05roush0090]

Wow they honestly think there is very little to gain from headers? Idiots! As far as the tuner trying to sell you, that does happen. Sure some products offer little profit but let's not forget the labor to install it.