[101fng]

and why does the stock intake not flow enough at those high rpm's? serious question.

[Anthony05GT]

Mainly it just can't flow that well do to restrictions because of it's smaller port design. I mean, aftermarket intakes open them up, include longer runners for better flow and torque. They are also tested and retested to maximize flow.

[101fng]

i guess if you're going all out and have already put more money into the engine and drivetrain than the total cost of the car, then an aftermarket intake isn't such an assrape. but honestly, for 90% of us, an aftermarket intake is not worth it. the stock intake isn't nearly the greatest restriction in the engine. it's actually probably the least restrictive part. so after heads, cams, exhaust (no particular order), then maybe i can see an aftermarket intake as the next logical step.

[Anthony05GT]

I agree.

[IronStomach]

Basically everything that comes stock on the 3v 4.6 makes for a pretty balanced system, except in terms of the CAI+tune, there isn't anything else under a grand that gives really big all on it's own.

To see total end game gains, the entire system needs to be opened up to match. Judging by results, it's worthless to open up early flow (TB, intake) if the heads don't accomodate that increase in flow.

Otherwise it's a bunch of little mods to make a big system. 5 here, 5 there, 5-10 in 5-10 different spots makes solid gains. But I think this is why Ford is scrapping the 4.6 and 5.4 designs: all the headroom has already been bought.

[07stanggt]

Originally Posted by 101fng aren't u the one always dismissing dyno #s and asking for time slips?

I am. I beleive what I said is that the internet blows them off. I learned this personally.

Originally Posted by mustangfan123 Yep, just about. They dynoed their car at 403rwhp w/o the C&L manifold. I wish it would have gained more than 12rwhp on that car.

So the livernois car is the Gospel on this one. Did you notice anything odd about that dyno? Oh thats right, if a 323 only gained xxx then a 4.6 will gain less right? Do you have a link to this car for me to illustrate something real fast?

Originally Posted by EfylSetaf He's also the one who uses sarcasm more than he doesn't.

I have.

Originally Posted by 101fng anyway, back on topic. unless you're putting down good power, what would make the <15rwhp worth the 700-800 dollars?

Jesus Christ has not blessed the 15rwhp gain as the end all to be all yet. Usable revolutions per minute.

There are a lot of variables not considered.

[Mickey]

Originally Posted by 07stanggt Watch what you say or you might be eating crow my freind.

[07stanggt]

Originally Posted by Mickey

What are you rolling your eyes at? So you think it wont make power on my 4.6?

[07stanggt]

Question for some n/a guys genuinely interested in this. Did any of you notice anything odd about that dyno that he mf123 linked?

[menace07]

Following this thread closely...

[menace07]

the only thing that struck me as wierd is that the power seemed to taper off after 6k rpm, but maybe thats normal...I'm a retard

[unlicensed to drive]

Originally Posted by 07stanggt I am. I beleive what I said is that the internet blows them off. I learned this personally. So the livernois car is the Gospel on this one. Did you notice anything odd about that dyno? Oh thats right, if a 323 only gained xxx then a 4.6 will gain less right? Do you have a link to this car for me to illustrate something real fast?

Sorry for the slow reply, I was busy on another website. I did not notice anything abnormal about the graph besides that the red HP line is cut off, so it doesn't show where it drops off.

One would think so because that car has very aggressive cams, high flow cylinder heads, and more cubic inches, so obviously it is going to be drawing in more air, which puts a larger demand on parts that aren't upgraded. If you mean the upgrades, then here:

Livernois Motorsports 323ci Big Bore Stroker Longblock
Livernois Motorsports Stage 3 CNC Heads
Livernois Motorsports Custom Camshafts
Livernois Motorsports Cam Phaser Limiters
Livernois Motorsports Crankshaft Scraper
Livernois "Reload" CNC Valve Covers
C&L Intake Manifold
Innovators West Damper
Kooks Longtube Headers and X-Pipe w/ Cats
Whipple Single Blade Throttle Body
Ram Clutch
Dynotech 1-Piece Driveshaft
Ford Racing Handling Package

I am positive that it still had the stock bullitt CAI. Oh and here's the link to the thread over on s197forum:

C&L Arrived for N/A Big Bore Stroker.. Pics! - WWW.S197FORUM.COM

[07stanggt]

Originally Posted by menace07 the only thing that struck me as wierd is that the power seemed to taper off after 6k rpm, but maybe thats normal...I'm a retard

Im a retard as well so we're at least on the same page.

I agree. the power curve stayed exactly the same for the different runner lengths. The short runner made more power everywhere and droped off at the same point?

I saw it pull to 6800 on a car.

There is another MM&FF article coming out on this.

[07stanggt]

Thanks mf. I was really looking more for the car. What trans is in the car they dynoed this on? Auto or manual? what size rims/tires, gears, etc. Those are the things i was wondering.

[unlicensed to drive]

No problem. It is a 2009 Bullitt, which indicates that it's a manual. I would assume that it still has the OEM TR3650 transmission in it. I have no idea what gearing or wheels/tires it had on it though because Rick@Livernois never mentioned it in the thread, but I might be able to find out by PMing him.

I just noticed something about the dynograph which disappoints me. They used STD correction. I wish that car made those numbers SAE.

[07stanggt]

Originally Posted by mustangfan123 No problem. It is a 2009 Bullitt, which indicates that it's a manual. I would assume that it still has the OEM TR3650 transmission in it. I have no idea what gearing or wheels/tires it had on it though because Rick@Livernois never mentioned it in the thread, but I might be able to find out by PMing him. I just noticed something about the dynograph which disappoints me. They used STD correction. I wish that car made those numbers SAE.

LOL. I have a sae corrected dyno for my car that says 399 and a standard that says 389, same mods. Which do you beleive?

You are to worried about correction factors.

Menace nailed it.

Its flatlining at 6k like menace said. At 6k my car only maks 370. You wanna know. Maybe the reason why a stock bottom end n/a car made 409 when a stroker only makes 420 is becuase one is peaking at 6000 and the other is peaking at 6800.

[unlicensed to drive]

Originally Posted by 07stanggt LOL. I have a sae corrected dyno for my car that says 399 and a standard that says 389, same mods. Which do you beleive? You are to worried about correction factors. Menace nailed it. Its flatlining at 6k like menace said. At 6k my car only maks 370. You wanna know. Maybe the reason why a stock bottom end n/a car made 409 when a stroker only makes 420 is becuase one is peaking at 6000 and the other is peaking at 6800.

That makes a lot of sense. I wonder what the stroker would make if it pulled to 6800.

[07stanggt]

Here is another thing that no one seems to ask. What is the grind on this cam? Just becuase its custom doesnt mean is the most aggressive cam on the planet. What were they going for with it. What rpm will that cam pull to, what rpm does the cam come on. Just a thought.

To disect those livernois numbers we need do a little more then assume its the perfect engine for the question at hand. If the c&L made all that power before and up to 6k its really not that bad considering what we really want I really want to know is what it makes to 7k. And it doesnt mean that it will do worse on a 281.

[07stanggt]

Originally Posted by mustangfan123 That makes a lot of sense. I wonder what the stroker would make if it pulled to 6800.

Maybe it doesnt like to rev.

[unlicensed to drive]

Originally Posted by 07stanggt Here is another thing that no one seems to ask. What is the grind on this cam? Just becuase its custom doesnt mean is the most aggressive cam on the planet. What were they going for with it. What rpm will that cam pull to, what rpm does the cam come on. Just a thought. To disect those livernois numbers we need do a little more then assume its the perfect engine for the question at hand. If the c&L made all that power before and up to 6k its really not that bad considering what we really want I really want to know is what it makes to 7k. And it doesnt mean that it will do worse on a 281.

Yeah they never posted the specs of the cams used, so I just assumed that they used a cam which would allow that car to make power pretty high up in the rpm's, but I'm dumb for that. You could not be more correct about what we want to know. I hope that someone can give us that information, but the only way to find out is to contact Livernois.