Burning Oil

SKRAPR · November 6th, 2009, 08:19 PM

A few weeks after my cams went in, I started noticing that a puff of blue-white smoke comes out of the tail pipes when it's cold and I crank it up. I know it's burning oil. I checked it the other day . . . and it was WAAAAY LOW . . . I am embarased to say. I immediately put oil in.

But, I guess I didn't realize it was such a huge problem because it does not appear to burn oil while driving. Only when she's cold and I first crank her up. So I started checking into it and . . . from what I read . . . is what can happen if the valve seals are bad. Oil settles into the combustion chamber through the valve seals.

The cams were Comp SPR's. So, new valve springs had to also go in as a result. That's pretty close to the valve seal? I'm not sure. Should I assume that this was something that happened during the install of the cams and the shop should now fix it? It's been probably 6 months now. Or, is this something that just happens to engines over time. Mine has about 57K miles. (I also read that aging motors can burn about a quart per 1K miles)

BostonPerformance · November 6th, 2009, 08:24 PM

With under 100k miles I don't think it should be burning oil noticeably... Have the shop look at that gasket.

07GTconvertible · November 6th, 2009, 08:50 PM

I wouldn't say an aging motor burns a quart per 1 k, I would say a DYING motor burns that much! If you are truly burning that much (due to engine wear), you are on your death bed. I blew up a 5.0 doing that so I should know.

So you are saying you had a shop install the cams and new springs, and that's it, right? (valves were not replaced, head was not removed, valve seals were not replaced?)

What could be happening is that when the car is parked, there is some oil left in the head, and its seeping past the valve seals. So perhaps the seals came loose or were damaged when the springs are being replaced. Or if they put new valve seals in then they weren't properly installed. This is pure conjecture, but it seems reasonable. It doesn't seem reasonable, unless there is a LOT of engine abuse that you haven't told us about, that your car should be burning oil from engine wear.

SKRAPR · November 6th, 2009, 09:17 PM

Actually, when they were doing the cams . . . the plugs broke . . . at least on did. Dropped down into the chamber. They had to pull the heads to get it out. Do you think that was it?

SKRAPR · November 6th, 2009, 09:18 PM

My car definitely has not been abused. I should actually try to abuse a little more . . . since it IS a mustang and all :-)

07GTconvertible · November 6th, 2009, 09:39 PM

So now you have the possibility of a head gasket leak too. (did the replace the head gaskets(s)?) I'm not sure how mechanically inclined you are, but if I had to try to determine if it was a head gasket leak vs a valve seal leak, I would do a compression test. Of course this means you would have to remove all the spark plugs (which you may or may not want to risk doing based on your past experience). So if you have an oil leak at the head gasket, I would think it would be isolated to one or two cylinders. If you had a leak there, then I would expect the compression test to be low at that (those) cylinders. If the compression test is equal across all cylinders, then you probably don't have a leak at the head gasket.

All this said, and again this is my PERSONAL OPINION (i.e. not fact), in all likelihood something went wrong on that cam install. Do you have a warranty with the shop? If so they should just fix it. Even if not, you should probably talk to them anyway.

Sorry bro, bad situation no matter how you look at it. That's why I do my own work, then I can only blame myself.

SKRAPR · November 6th, 2009, 11:27 PM

Yeah . . . I wanted to try the cam install myself. Just not comfortable messing with the timing chain at all. Did the LT's myself . . . that wasn't so bad. Anyway . . .

judging on the fact that I did not have the problem before the install, I'm almost certain it must be the cam install . . . or when they pulled the heads. The shop seems to be pretty stand-up. Just not sure since it's been 6 months. I already talked to them and they said bring it by next week. So we'll see. Thanks for the info. Reps, Bro!

UrbanRedneck · November 7th, 2009, 01:11 AM

A head gasket leak would be more evident when driving, because the oil galleys would have oil in them to leak through the gasket into the chamber. That little bit on cold start is almost always valve seals. I call it chevy-itus. The oil sitting in the head seeps past the seals when the engine is off, and burns in the chamber when you start it. Once running, not enough oil really gets around the seals to make them leak, and the valves expand slightly from heat.

No car with 57k should burn oil in a significant amount unless something was wrong. I;d take it back to them and have them check it out.

November 6th, 2009, 08:19 PM	#1
SKRAPR Regular 2005 Mustang GT Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Charlotte, NC Posts: 277 iTrader: 0 reviews	Burning Oil A few weeks after my cams went in, I started noticing that a puff of blue-white smoke comes out of the tail pipes when it's cold and I crank it up. I know it's burning oil. I checked it the other day . . . and it was WAAAAY LOW . . . I am embarased to say. I immediately put oil in. But, I guess I didn't realize it was such a huge problem because it does not appear to burn oil while driving. Only when she's cold and I first crank her up. So I started checking into it and . . . from what I read . . . is what can happen if the valve seals are bad. Oil settles into the combustion chamber through the valve seals. The cams were Comp SPR's. So, new valve springs had to also go in as a result. That's pretty close to the valve seal? I'm not sure. Should I assume that this was something that happened during the install of the cams and the shop should now fix it? It's been probably 6 months now. Or, is this something that just happens to engines over time. Mine has about 57K miles. (I also read that aging motors can burn about a quart per 1K miles) __________________ Skrapr 2005 Mustang GT (5-spd Manual) FRPP 4.10's Kooks LT's \| Kooks Cat'd X C&L Racer CAI Dyno'd \| SCT-X3 MGW Shifter \| MGW Interior Details Comp XFI SPR Stage-II's

November 6th, 2009, 08:24 PM	#2
BostonPerformance Enthusiast 99 Cherokee sport/87 5.0 not tested Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: san antonio, tx Posts: 989 iTrader: 0 reviews	With under 100k miles I don't think it should be burning oil noticeably... Have the shop look at that gasket. __________________ [CENTER]"Not the victory but the action; Not the goal but the game; In the deed the glory," -Hartley Burr Alexander

November 6th, 2009, 09:17 PM	#4
SKRAPR Regular 2005 Mustang GT Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Charlotte, NC Posts: 277 iTrader: 0 reviews	Actually, when they were doing the cams . . . the plugs broke . . . at least on did. Dropped down into the chamber. They had to pull the heads to get it out. Do you think that was it? __________________ Skrapr 2005 Mustang GT (5-spd Manual) FRPP 4.10's Kooks LT's \| Kooks Cat'd X C&L Racer CAI Dyno'd \| SCT-X3 MGW Shifter \| MGW Interior Details Comp XFI SPR Stage-II's

November 6th, 2009, 09:18 PM	#5
SKRAPR Regular 2005 Mustang GT Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Charlotte, NC Posts: 277 iTrader: 0 reviews	My car definitely has not been abused. I should actually try to abuse a little more . . . since it IS a mustang and all :-) __________________ Skrapr 2005 Mustang GT (5-spd Manual) FRPP 4.10's Kooks LT's \| Kooks Cat'd X C&L Racer CAI Dyno'd \| SCT-X3 MGW Shifter \| MGW Interior Details Comp XFI SPR Stage-II's

November 6th, 2009, 11:27 PM	#7
SKRAPR Regular 2005 Mustang GT Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Charlotte, NC Posts: 277 iTrader: 0 reviews	Yeah . . . I wanted to try the cam install myself. Just not comfortable messing with the timing chain at all. Did the LT's myself . . . that wasn't so bad. Anyway . . . judging on the fact that I did not have the problem before the install, I'm almost certain it must be the cam install . . . or when they pulled the heads. The shop seems to be pretty stand-up. Just not sure since it's been 6 months. I already talked to them and they said bring it by next week. So we'll see. Thanks for the info. Reps, Bro! __________________ Skrapr 2005 Mustang GT (5-spd Manual) FRPP 4.10's Kooks LT's \| Kooks Cat'd X C&L Racer CAI Dyno'd \| SCT-X3 MGW Shifter \| MGW Interior Details Comp XFI SPR Stage-II's

November 6th, 2009, 08:50 PM	#3
07GTconvertible Regular 2007 Mustang GT 'vert Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: CT Posts: 285 iTrader: 0 reviews	I wouldn't say an aging motor burns a quart per 1 k, I would say a DYING motor burns that much! If you are truly burning that much (due to engine wear), you are on your death bed. I blew up a 5.0 doing that so I should know. So you are saying you had a shop install the cams and new springs, and that's it, right? (valves were not replaced, head was not removed, valve seals were not replaced?) What could be happening is that when the car is parked, there is some oil left in the head, and its seeping past the valve seals. So perhaps the seals came loose or were damaged when the springs are being replaced. Or if they put new valve seals in then they weren't properly installed. This is pure conjecture, but it seems reasonable. It doesn't seem reasonable, unless there is a LOT of engine abuse that you haven't told us about, that your car should be burning oil from engine wear.

November 6th, 2009, 09:39 PM	#6
07GTconvertible Regular 2007 Mustang GT 'vert Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: CT Posts: 285 iTrader: 0 reviews	So now you have the possibility of a head gasket leak too. (did the replace the head gaskets(s)?) I'm not sure how mechanically inclined you are, but if I had to try to determine if it was a head gasket leak vs a valve seal leak, I would do a compression test. Of course this means you would have to remove all the spark plugs (which you may or may not want to risk doing based on your past experience). So if you have an oil leak at the head gasket, I would think it would be isolated to one or two cylinders. If you had a leak there, then I would expect the compression test to be low at that (those) cylinders. If the compression test is equal across all cylinders, then you probably don't have a leak at the head gasket. All this said, and again this is my PERSONAL OPINION (i.e. not fact), in all likelihood something went wrong on that cam install. Do you have a warranty with the shop? If so they should just fix it. Even if not, you should probably talk to them anyway. Sorry bro, bad situation no matter how you look at it. That's why I do my own work, then I can only blame myself.

November 7th, 2009, 01:11 AM	#8
UrbanRedneck Hardcore Enthusiast 2008 Mustang GT 13.124@105.52 Join Date: May 2008 Location: Chicago Posts: 2,138 iTrader: 1 reviews	A head gasket leak would be more evident when driving, because the oil galleys would have oil in them to leak through the gasket into the chamber. That little bit on cold start is almost always valve seals. I call it chevy-itus. The oil sitting in the head seeps past the seals when the engine is off, and burns in the chamber when you start it. Once running, not enough oil really gets around the seals to make them leak, and the valves expand slightly from heat. No car with 57k should burn oil in a significant amount unless something was wrong. I;d take it back to them and have them check it out. __________________ Hurst Crew Member #20 2008 GT - ARH, C&L, Hurst, BORLA, BMR, Bilstein, FRPP, Axle Exchange. Awesome.

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