[ujslost]

Been around mustangs for a while now, but I just bought a 97 vert GT.
I been reading alot of websites and MMFF and 50&Sf articles also about the pi and non pi mod motors. I am torn between buying a set of 99+ pi heads w/cams, and intake , or buying some patriot performance heads and the new trick flow 4.6 intake. I know for sure I want that trick flow intake because I might want to use some n2o in the future so I want an aluminum intake and I like the TF intake on the 5.0s so I want to try the TF intake on a 4.6 now.

From what I see around the internet the Stock PI set up is around $1200+ , or maybe I havnent found the cheapest place yet.
Patriot heads are about the same price $1200 and the TF intake is $799. So really I dont see that $800 is much more for the power those parts should yield. So I just want to get some veteran mod motor guys response on these ideas.

Another thing I see when I open my hood is "how damn hard is it to get the heads and headers off this damn block". So guys just how long and hard is it to get the heads and shit off these cars if i were to do it in the driveway. And then how hard and long is it if i had a lift to do this. ( I have a lift at work I just cant tie the lift up for days on end.

Nice site BTW glad to be here want to learn all the mod motor things that I can. Most ppl here are still pushrod guys. I know the mod motors and pushrod motors are a total differant ball game from one another.

[Boomer]

1 patriot heads (ported P.I) have a bad reputation. If you do not plan on making huge numbers with forced induction just run the plastic P.I. A $1000 aluminum intake can blow just like the plastic intake from a nitrous backfire. Running nitrous in the recommened max amount of 125 shot with a good tune, pressure gauge,window switch and ect. will help to prolong failure. The P.I intake and cams are alone worth around 40 rwhp and another 5-10 with the P.I heads, the P.I heads will raise your compression to about 10.4:1 and will require a tune for optimal performance on pump gas. Intalling new heads will require new tty head bolts or ARP bolts or studs. Average time for the noob to do heads approx 2 days. Cam timing needs to be triple checked.

2 exhaust manifolds are tough to remove without lowering the factory K member however it is possible. It would be a wise investment to install a new tubular k member while doing headers as it save huge amounts of time down the road as you access everything much easier. Count on a full day doing headers for the first time unless you have a lift to work from.

3 Now that your dealing with modulars the first thing you need to know, if it is cheaper you are getiing a less than quality part in most cases. Take what you read in the magazines with a grain of salt, the companies that advertise pay and can write just about anything to make you purchase their parts as they pay the mags to advertise.

4 There are a few people here that can tell that have tried most every part out and give advice on what is best suited for what you plan to do.

Welcome to the site and enjoy your stay....Btw the search button is your friend, however we do not minnd helping.

[MustangMatt96GT]

Well Patriot Performance had a bad reputation a while ago but it seems to be fixed, but while you are doing a head swap I would recommend something that costs more and that will do better, for example VT makes some killer stuff. Search in google VT engines. Good luck with the build, and I am soon going to be doing what you are. VT heads/SVO heads, VT cams, and the Trick Flow intake. It will be nice to see what type of numbers you will be pulling.

[ujslost]

An aluminum intake isn't going to blow like a plastic one would from a nitrous back fire. Its possible but not as likely. BTW a tubular k-memeber is certainly out of the question at this time, so would pulling the entire drive train out easier, and will the motor come out with the headers bolted to the block still?

BOOMER you said....The P.I intake and cams are alone worth around 40 rwhp.

is that to say that the head swap isnt worth the other 5-10 hp you mentioned? You suggest swapping the cams and the intake only, since they are the only significant power gains?

How much HP can a N/A 4.6 make with out having to forge the bottom end?
Im just looking to get my car to run 12s N/A. Im not looking for 9's,10's, or 11's because I havent got the time to race like I used to. I just want something fun to play with, without breaking shit all the time. This is my daily driver.

[Boomer]

Originally Posted by ujslost An aluminum intake isn't going to blow like a plastic one would from a nitrous back fire. Its possible but not as likely. BTW a tubular k-memeber is certainly out of the question at this time, so would pulling the entire drive train out easier, and will the motor come out with the headers bolted to the block still? BOOMER you said....The P.I intake and cams are alone worth around 40 rwhp. is that to say that the head swap isnt worth the other 5-10 hp you mentioned? You suggest swapping the cams and the intake only, since they are the only significant power gains? How much HP can a N/A 4.6 make with out having to forge the bottom end? Im just looking to get my car to run 12s N/A. Im not looking for 9's,10's, or 11's because I havent got the time to race like I used to. I just want something fun to play with, without breaking shit all the time. This is my daily driver.

Any intake will blow from a backfire, spend 200 on a P.I and blow two up and your still ahead. I was only suggesting the P.I because it is proven hard to beat for the money, you can spend 600-1400 to only gain a few horsepower if you choose. The factor is any aluminuim intake suffers from heat soak which does rob power. A strong tune and all the features I mentioned will limit the possibility of a backfire and intake failure.
Power, expect a average of 300 rwhp N/A and being limited to around 425-450 with a power adder again a tune can make a or break any engine. If you have the money the P.I heads are a nice gain ported having the advantage of the better cylinder quenching and smaller combustion chamber averaging 5-10 at the most. Porting the P.I heads , the companies that have true gains rermove a portion of the area that improves the quenching effect to improve the velocity lost by the short side raduis on the intake runner. Put the same money into a set of NPI heads and you wil better results thru the power band N/A as the intake runner can flow with the best of any ported P.I with higher air velocity as it has a more direct flow path. The ongoing problem with the 2 valve head is the intake runner, shape, design and flow charactoristics limit the power they can make.
With limited mods(engine) and a well worked suspesion you can run easy high 13's. Cams (aftermarket) P.I intake ,U/D pullies, gears, upper plenum with T/B and a free flowing exhaust could nety you 12's.

If you are looking for the cost efficient way find a P.I engine drop it in a mod it from there, however all the power in the world may still not get you in the 12's if you are not willing to spend the money to apply it to the ground. The suspension will make the car apply the new found power.

You can take my advice with a grain of salt, it is reality and most people choose to believe hearsay.

[Boomer]

here rough example sorry for the size, this is a standard P.I head (polished) I showed the area that gets cut back which negates the added "p.i. power effect.