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Project Second Hand Snake

168K views 1K replies 188 participants last post by  WickedSnake00 
#1 ·
Never thought the day would come. Project Secondhand Snake is finally under way. Today I got the most difficult part of the build, a complete Eaton swap kit.

Objective: To create a complete 03/04 Cobra clone using only secondhand parts, as low cost as possible. Exceptions to the Cobra design include an S-281 spoiler, Bullitt rims, and possible Mach 1 gauge cluster. Paint will be all black, with a custom asymmetric ghost snakeskin pattern on the rear.

Background: Project started in March 2010, when I purchased a 2000 Mustang GT with an astounding number of 03/04 Cobra parts on it already. In addition a number of aftermarket upgrades were already installed. These include 03/04 Cobra bumpers, scoops, interior (minus gauges), brakes, suspension, 01 Cobra T3650 transmission, P-71 interceptor motor, bilstein shocks, fully welded subframe connectors, off road X pipe, mufflers, cat-back, lowered 2", stiffer progressive rate springs in rear, softer fixed rate in front, Centerforce II clutch, aluminum flywheel, pioneer head unit w/600 watt amp, shaved door handles, C&L CAI, TB, grille delete, rolled fenders and likely a few more things that I'm missing.

Cost of the car (plus all the extra parts that were thrown in); $3500

At that point, the car was a complete and total paperweight. Massive front camber problems, electrical problems, locked up brakes, vacuum leaks, exhaust leaks, a caved in quarterpanel, poorly done shaved doorhandles, primer everywhere, poorly installed gas tank, unhooked e-brake, misaligned bumper, misaligned fenders, misaligned hood, bad bearings and destroyed tires. Here it is when I got it:


After that, I put a considerable amount of work in to fix all the aforementioned issues, and got it to pass NYS inspection.

Cost of repairs; $500 All work was done by myself, with the exception of the inspection, and the bearing being pressed in, I don't have a press. Low cost, but hours upon hours of labor.




...and then the body work was done...





Total so far: $4000

I originally thought I got hosed for buying such a paperweight for $3500, but considering as it sits it's better than a stock GT, and it only took that little to repair, I think I made out pretty well.

Stay tuned for Part 2! :D
 
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#3 ·
Part II: Where We Are Now

Picking up where we left off...

At this point it was late September. The decision was made to go for full clone. As a recent graduate who was working production, I didn't have an extensive budget. Then life threw me a curveball. In November I moved from Buffalo, NY to Columbus, IN, for a mechanical engineering position with Cummins, Inc. Unfortunately due to a lack of storage space here, the car is still sitting back in Buffalo, but I already have more than enough earmarked to finish the project when I get it here.

Since the move, I acquired a set of 03/04 Cobra sideskirts for $300 just before Christmas, and finally today, a complete Eaton swap kit for $2500. Previous owner sold it after punching a hole in his block. He was running 498hp/540ft-lb with a 3" pulley and this ported Eaton M112 on 93 octane. Not a good idea for a stock 01 Cobra engine. Also a big bonus that numerous parts were powdercoated black by him already.

Here's the haul from today:
Carbon fiber intake with filter and MAF:

Eaton M112 and manifold:

Heat Exchanger:

Timing Cover:

Big f*cking box of all the other parts:

And bonus! OEM Cobra gauge cluster!


Coming next: Part 3
 
#4 ·
Part III: Where We're Going

Now to discuss future plans.

First things first, there's the logistics I need. To even work on it, I need to rent a garage, and tow it down here. Since family and friends seem to be unwilling to help, I'm going to have to speed up my purchase of a 2011 Dodge Ram 2500 with the Cummins ISB 6.7L diesel. If all else fails I may return to Buffalo and complete it in my garage there.

[ ] New truck
[ ] Garage
[ ] Engine Hoist

Now the list of parts:
[X] Car w/obscene amount of aftermarket parts
[X] Sideskirts
[X] Eaton swap
[ ] T-56 transmission
[ ] Lincoln Aviator or Mercury Marauder engine
[ ] MMR forged rotating assembly
[ ] Stage II blower cams (HE292 I think is the code?)
[ ] Level 5 half shafts
[ ] Twin GT fuel pumps and hat
[ ] Injectors
[ ] SCT PRP tuning package
[ ] Paint
[ ] 17 x 10.5" Bullitt rims x2
[ ] S-281 spoiler
[ ] 03/04 Cobra hood
[ ] Possibly clutch/flywheel if current one is not re-used
[ ] Big brake kit
[ ] Single blade TB
[ ] Stiffer front springs
[ ] Stainless "Cobra" rear bumper inserts
[ ] Lots and lots of IRS parts. Bushings, braces, etc...

When all is said and done I'll be shooting for 500-550hp. More than enough to settle some scores. Especially since there's a nasty rumor going around I've just got a V-6 with a body kit. I'm almost tempted to put the V-6 bumpers on and give some people a rude surprise...

Whew. I think that's it. I'm almost sure there's more to it. I'll keep updating the build thread as it happens. It would be wonderful if I could get this done this summer, but only time will tell.

...And if anyone around Columbus has a garage for rent let me know.
 
#5 ·
Very good, I am impressed with your build.

I believe you will need another fpdm, one for each GT pump. Also you may need a longer drive shaft or a spacer for the t-56 setup.

As you well know there are tons of misc things required for a build like this. Good luck and let me know if you need anything.
 
#31 ·
Thats what I think as well...
 
#9 ·
What I was thinking, considering he can buy a cobra now for 15000. Buit 4v motor is 6 grand minimum, t56 3500, irs (not worth it), seats 500 min, hood 400, cobra fuel system 500 used min, tune 400, clutch 375+, and this is the cheap prices that usualy dont pop up.
 
#12 ·
Thanks for the tips.

As far as the fuel arrangement I'm hoping to get a whole Cobra tank setup over on SVTP. That would be easiest. There's lots of guys over there with waaaaay too much money that are always selling their parts when they upgrade. Perfect source for a mild build like this.

And I totally forgot about driveshaft. I could get mine milled down but it'd be easier to just buy a new one. I'll also have to check gear ratios, especially with the fact there's wide and close ratio T56's.

stal-I'm not too worried about the budget. To get it to Cobra spec it won't take much, but I'm going above and beyond. It won't cost much for the engine and trans, since I'll be able to sell my current one to offset the cost. In the end I'm hoping to be below $12k. Well below a comparable used Cobra, and less than some GT's I've seen. Doing all this work yourself saves some serious coin. I don't care about the resale of it either, I don't plan on selling it. Ever.

I'm also sure I'll be asking some questions about installing the Eaton swap. I literally have a giant bin of random parts. The thing is well over 200lbs! I'll have to read over Lefty's thread several times, but it'll take some work to figure things out. Oh well. I like a challenge, that's what this build is all about. When others would buy a Cobra, I'll build one. It'll look damn good when it's finished to say engine, paint, and tuning all done by me.
 
#915 ·
just found myself reading through some of this and i just thought that one part about selling it was kinda funny seeing as where it is now. but i know that feeling, i said i would never sell my black gt but now i have a red one waiting to replace it in the garage
 
#14 ·
I got my cobra for 9500 which came out to 11000 out the door, I dont think your project will be underthat, nore do I think you will be under 12000, but if you do keep it under keep us posted. Plenty of others are intdrested in this swap
 
#21 ·
First off wow, overwhelmed by the responses.

And the Eaton swap is a starting point. I can easily replace it with a KB or Whipple on a whim. I'm going to focus on this as a start though. I could also sell it off later and go turbo, it's just the start.

As far as the T56, I like the extra gear. And as much as I hate to admit it, I hated the shaved doorhandles and headlights when I bought it, but they've grown on me, and I'm going to keep them. Just one of the many very unique aspects of it.

At least I don't have euro taillights.:eek:

Also regarding insurance, I may not get the coverage but I do pay less than half the premium because the VIN is GT.

But in the end it's just a project. If I end up over budget so be it, it's my work of art, and hopefully others can learn from it.
 
#19 ·
He plans on spending below 12k. Say he spends 10k. 3500+10k=13500. Another 500 bucks and you can find termis all day. I seen one in OHIO yesterday for 12900. 03 Redfire vert termi with 87,000 miles.




Also on the motor building estimate, i have one tip dont estimate. If your guess is 4g its 6 grand. If your guess is 2k is 3k. Trust me.
 
#23 ·
Ah I saw that in the classifieds and I was tempted. But then I'd still need to get all the heads and hardware.

Plus I've got nowhere to store it and no way to transport it right now. Tough to stuff a shortblock in a Neon you know? (Though putting 2 quarterpanels, a deck lid and a fender is possible. Ask me how I know.) And as is I've got all the supercharger parts sitting in my living room. Smells like a nice mix of gas, oil, and coolant in that corner.
 
#25 ·
I don't mind what others say, I know in the end it's my build. Quite honestly even if this cost me an arm and a leg I'd still go through with it. It's more the fun of building it than anything else.

And wishful build thoughts? Dude, I'm horribly jealous of you and that steal you got on your Cobra. If I could have gotten one that cheap you can bet mine would be on the front lawn with a for sale sign. You should list one of your mods as a horseshoe up your ass, because I can't explain that kind of luck otherwise.:p
 
#28 ·
Well I'm back from a trip to SoCal to run fuel system tests for work. First some anecdotes. I found the other engineers in the group loved their fast cars, and would buy and sell them on a whim. These guys drove everything from brand new GTO's to BMW's to Porsches. At the same time, none of them wrenched on them or upgraded them. Such a terrible shame. I'm extremely glad I'm embarking on this road.

Regarding cost-
I could technically have this Eaton swap done for another $200 or so. That'd put the grand total under $7000 for a 500hp car. Granted the components may not last that long at that level. That really isn't too shabby. But since this is a project, a work of art, I'm going all out. This isn't meant to be a clone but rather an extremely gratifying one of a kind build. Something that fits you like a glove when you're done. Also putting this in perspective, even if I go over budget and end up with close to $15k sunk into it, it's not at the level of a $15k termi vert, it's going to be with the likes of a $25k modded termi coupe. And to those that advocate a cheaper powerplant than the Eaton swap...I do admit that is partially true. In this month's Hot Rod magazine a budget LS put down 600hp for about $3500. But to get myself an LS vehicle would be close to $10k, so I'll count myself lucky.

Alright. Rant over. Back to the build.

Additional parts I forgot to mention: Wideband, poly engine mounts, custom gauges.

Engine build:
I'm electing to go with a rotating assembly from MMR. I'm opting for the 11cc dish, which should put me at a rather comfortable 9.1:1 or so CR. I'm also stepping up to the Manley 4340 pistons and H beam rods. Any reccommendations on alternate hardware brands/sources? I know the MMR hardware is only good up to around 550hp, and I'd rather have the extra room to grow for when I slap on a KB or Whipple. The Manley upgrades should put me in the neighborhood of 800hp.

And as always I'm sure there's some deals going on with MMR for forum members. If I'm not mistaken I've talked with a dealer for them who's on here about this before. I guess now he knows I'm serious. :D

For cams I can't quite remember the model number/manufacturer I was looking at. I vaguely remember "262" in the title, and they were stage II blower cams. I recall seeing them mentioned numerous times and highly reccommended. If anyone can help on that end it'd be greatly appreciated. Otherwise it's back to digging through threads. Also will there be any PTV clearance issues with this?

I'm also going to pick up a book on building Mod motors since this will be my first. I've built a number of pushrod motors in the past, but this will be my first DOHC.

Transmission build:
Still going with a T-56. Any suggestions for sourcing? I'd prefer to go used to keep with the theme of the build. I know Jazzer picked one up for his swap awhile ago, not sure if he'll chime in.

Tuning:
I might opt to just get an SCT tuner from AM with free tunes. This would save me a lot of headaches and time. And who isn't impatient? Plus hopefully this can turn my PATS off so I can pop that Cobra dash cluster in ASAP.

Whew. Never a dull moment.
 
#90 ·
For cams I can't quite remember the model number/manufacturer I was looking at. I vaguely remember "262" in the title, and they were stage II blower cams. I recall seeing them mentioned numerous times and highly reccommended. If anyone can help on that end it'd be greatly appreciated. Otherwise it's back to digging through threads. Also will there be any PTV clearance issues with this?

Transmission build:
Still going with a T-56. Any suggestions for sourcing? I'd prefer to go used to keep with the theme of the build. I know Jazzer picked one up for his swap awhile ago, not sure if he'll chime in.

Tuning:
I might opt to just get an SCT tuner from AM with free tunes. This would save me a lot of headaches and time. And who isn't impatient? Plus hopefully this can turn my PATS off so I can pop that Cobra dash cluster in ASAP.

Whew. Never a dull moment.
As for the cams you're probably thinking of the HP292 cams. Those are for a 2v though, aren't you going four valve? Just remember that doing cams on a 4v is twice as expensive. Cams are usually $1200 plus all the valves, springs, guides, etc. Gets really expensive really quick.

Jazzer bought a new T56 from Pro Motion. You can usually find a decent one on SVTP for $1200-$1500 depending on what you get with it. If you can get a 26 spline input shaft - do it. You'll also want to look for the bellhousing, crossmember, and driveshaft from the Cobra. You'll want the reverse lockout solenoid pigtail with that stuff to, or you won't be able to shift into reverse.

You might want to check with AM on whether or not bama will give you free tunes for a setup like yours. Usually they are just tuning for CAI's and exhaust or whatever, not engine swaps with cams, blowers, CR changes, etc. I'm having an awesome experience with Amazon Tuning Solutions. They deal with a ton of Termis and Cobra swapped GTs.


And fast? Eh, I guess I'd call 550hp ish pretty quick. There's a guy back home with a 97 Cobra vert running a 76mm turbo and putting down 780rwhp. Now that I'd call fast.
I probably have 220-250 rwhp on F8L and only run a couple of tenths faster than him in the 1/4. Horsepower doesn't equal fast.

Fuel system-
Anyone have a good list as to what exactly it would take to change over a GT to 03/04 Cobra twin pumps? There's scores of setups going for dirt cheap over on SVTP, and I want to make sure I get all the parts I need, and none I don't.
Fuel injectors are also dirt cheap there. Someone is always going bigger and better and selling their old ones. I'd like to get 42 lb/hr's, but I can get 39's for around $150.
Do yourself a favor and get at least 60 lb/hr injectors. They are for sale all the time on SVTP. The 39's are going to be close to maxed at 500 rwhp and the 42's don't give you that much more breathing room.

Never! I love my IRS. Did I mention I already have an 03/04 Cobra IRS with 3.55 gears? That was a big bonus of buying the car. I'm not a huge strip guy and I love the twisties, so I'm sticking with that for the time being.
If you have an IRS don't waste money on Level 5 half shafts, especially if you don't track it that much. The problem isn't with the 03/04 half shafts, it's with the shitty rubber bushings in the IRS. Check out AC427 (I think) on SVTP or read up on the bushing kits from Full Tilt Boogie.



As a final thought...

Don't take this the wrong way, but my best piece of advice for you would be to just sit back and make a plan from start to finish before you start buying things. This thread hasn't been up long and you've already been flip flopping between Eaton swaps and shortblocks and longblocks and everything in between.

You should do a month or two of straight reading and talking to differnt people or companies or tuners about what you plan to do. After you have a solid and complete plan that no one can convince you to change, then start in on your project. It's going to suck if you sink $5k into this project and then find out that you're taking the wrong route.

I don't think you need to be stuck on the "termi" swap for the engine. My suggestion would be to find a teksid block, put in a forged rotating assembly, upgraded oil pump, ARP head and main studs, good rings, bearings, seals, gaskets, etc Top end would be your choice. If you want a PD blower, do C heads. Centri or turbo I'd do B heads. If you want a cheaper build, do 2v heads. That would be doing it the right way the first time, but it's going to be expensive. If you want the cheapest route you're probably going to be looking at a termi longblock and hoping the previous owner didn't beat the piss out of it.
 
#30 ·
Where and How much for the supercharger? Thats going to be a smokin ass fast car! Nice!
 
#32 ·
I bought the supercharger kit for $2500 from a guy in southern Indiana off of SVTPerformance forums. Keep in mind the supercharger itself is a very small part of that kit, and it includes the timing cover, intake manifold, harness, PS pump, Alternator, pulleys and probably close to 100 parts. It's a huge kit. You might be able to snag one over there, but I doubt you'd get such a complete kit. I lucked out on this one. I had made the decision to go turbo a couple of weeks prior, and I'm glad I didn't order any parts for it when this popped up.

And fast? Eh, I guess I'd call 550hp ish pretty quick. There's a guy back home with a 97 Cobra vert running a 76mm turbo and putting down 780rwhp. Now that I'd call fast.
 
#33 ·
Yea its someone we know named Jacob...
 
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