Plans for fun street car

IsaidWOT · February 1st, 2012, 09:50 PM

My original plan was for a Vortech unit, but upon further research, it won't provide a nice punch down around 2,000 rpms. That's what I'm looking for, riding at 2k and punching it and having massive torque. Is a twin screw the way?

SSG Pate · February 1st, 2012, 09:55 PM

Your not going to get MASSIVE torque out of these small cube engines, but a Roots style blower will definately come on stronger then a centrifugal blower will at low boost, but somewhere around 3800RPM better watch out for the centris.. Are you planning a forged block? if so once you get in high boost levels i think the centris and roots are comprable especially if you have the right gearing.

Blak GT · February 1st, 2012, 09:59 PM

Kenne Bell ftw!

95mustangGT/SVT · February 1st, 2012, 10:02 PM

I may be mistaken but I believe that the on3 turbo kit kicks in pretty hard in the 2.3-3k range

IsaidWOT · February 1st, 2012, 10:17 PM

I was comparing torque curves and the Kenne bell had a lt of torque at 2,000 rpm. That's what I'm looking for. I may want more power later, but I think the non-ic kit is looking like its what I want for now. I won't have the money for anything more.

zinc-vert02 · February 1st, 2012, 10:18 PM

lol do what i did and put a 3v 5.4 in ti with a roots blower

thats a ton of torqe lol

but yea a roots blower

SSG Pate · February 1st, 2012, 10:26 PM

Originally Posted by IsaidWOT

I was comparing torque curves and the Kenne bell had a lt of torque at 2,000 rpm. That's what I'm looking for. I may want more power later, but I think the non-ic kit is looking like its what I want for now. I won't have the money for anything more.

I was looking into this non intercooled Kenne bell as well when i was shopping, And Kenne belle told me to def go intercooled or i would loose alot of power to heat. just something to think about that thing running on the top of the engine with nothing to cool it down its gona get hot and rob you of some power.

mdb12002 · February 1st, 2012, 10:28 PM

You are going to run into issues if you dont build the motor, and have all that torque at lower end rpms. I recommend putting a forged shortblock in there, good luck though!

IsaidWOT · February 1st, 2012, 10:40 PM

Would there be a lot of heat even if I keep out of the boost? And also, how bad would it wear on my stock bottom end with 6psi?

JerseyTrueBlue · February 1st, 2012, 10:47 PM

Guys before you start telling this dude to get a shortblock please read the other thousands of threads just like this. We all know that 400whp is safe in any fi application as long as you're intercooled or using meth, your boost levels don't surpass 10-11 psi and you keep your timing under 14 degrees. It's all about cylinder pressure/heat. So lower you're boost while cooling your IAT's at the same time by adding an intercooler. If you are talking about a 6psi non intercooled kit that is plenty safe. My guess is you'd be somewhere around 350whp with that setup, however you could get much more power/boost and be a lot safer by spending the extra cash on the intercooled kit. If you don't want to blow up your car don't cut corners when building an FI motor! Enough said!

mdb12002 · February 1st, 2012, 10:59 PM

Originally Posted by JerseyTrueBlue

If you don't want to blow up your car don't cut corners when building an FI motor! Enough said!

So building a FI motor, and not forging the internals, is not cutting a corner? hmm...

MT0911 · February 1st, 2012, 11:01 PM

Originally Posted by JerseyTrueBlue

Guys before you start telling this dude to get a shortblock please read the other thousands of threads just like this. We all know that 400whp is safe in any fi application as long as you're intercooled or using meth, your boost levels don't surpass 10-11 psi and you keep your timing under 14 degrees. It's all about cylinder pressure/heat. So lower you're boost while cooling your IAT's at the same time by adding an intercooler. If you are talking about a 6psi non intercooled kit that is plenty safe. My guess is you'd be somewhere around 350whp with that setup, however you could get much more power/boost and be a lot safer by spending the extra cash on the intercooled kit. If you don't want to blow up your car don't cut corners when building an FI motor! Enough said!

^

cschoening09 · February 1st, 2012, 11:07 PM

i think he was meaning if the op were to go above and beyond the 350 whp and build the engine to support more boost/power. therefore if he wants more power than what the stock bottom end can handle, he needs to build his engine and build it right.(not cutting corners).that is if he doesnt want its to blow - correct me if im wrong Jerseyblue

T-Lee. 30 · February 1st, 2012, 11:10 PM

Centri and gears.... nah good luck with the hunt/decision

Eagle2000GT · February 1st, 2012, 11:44 PM

I've compared dynos from a KB and my ProCharger. Here are the results.

RPM.........KB @ 8 psi.........ProCharger
2500........165/345..............150/300 @ 1.8 psi
3000........200/355..............180/315 @ 2.6 psi
3500........240/360..............230/345 @ 3.4 psi
4000........275/362..............278/365 @ 4.2 psi
4500........310/362..............323/378 @ 5.0 psi
5000........340/360..............363/382 @ 6.1 psi
5500........370/350..............382/371 @ 7.5 psi
6000........375/330..............393/344 @ 8.9 psi

The twin-screw does in fact make more torque at low rpms than the centri. But how useful is it? With a centri I already have no traction in first on the street and the only time my motor is below 3800 rpms (the cross-over point of power from the twin-screw to the centri) is on launch. I really don't think the stress the low end torque puts on the rods is worth it.

T-Lee. 30 · February 2nd, 2012, 12:46 AM

Originally Posted by Eagle2000GT

I've compared dynos from a KB and my ProCharger. Here are the results.

RPM.........KB @ 8 psi.........ProCharger
2500........165/345..............150/300 @ 1.8 psi
3000........200/355..............180/315 @ 2.6 psi
3500........240/360..............230/345 @ 3.4 psi
4000........275/362..............278/365 @ 4.2 psi
4500........310/362..............323/378 @ 5.0 psi
5000........340/360..............363/382 @ 6.1 psi
5500........370/350..............382/371 @ 7.5 psi
6000........375/330..............393/344 @ 8.9 psi

The twin-screw does in fact make more torque at low rpms than the centri. But how useful is it? With a centri I already have no traction in first on the street and the only time my motor is below 3800 rpms (the cross-over point of power from the twin-screw to the centri) is on launch. I really don't think the stress the low end torque puts on the rods is worth it.

Spot on!

stal94gt · February 2nd, 2012, 12:52 AM

Originally Posted by IsaidWOT

Would there be a lot of heat even if I keep out of the boost? And also, how bad would it wear on my stock bottom end with 6psi?

yes a kb will constantly generate heat because it never stops spinning. also the sc is placed directly on top of the motor so it will heat soak no matter what. get an intercooled kit. as for wearing out parts. detonation kills get a good tune and less worries about problems.

IsaidWOT · February 2nd, 2012, 06:56 AM

Originally Posted by Eagle2000GT

I've compared dynos from a KB and my ProCharger. Here are the results.

RPM.........KB @ 8 psi.........ProCharger
2500........165/345..............150/300 @ 1.8 psi
3000........200/355..............180/315 @ 2.6 psi
3500........240/360..............230/345 @ 3.4 psi
4000........275/362..............278/365 @ 4.2 psi
4500........310/362..............323/378 @ 5.0 psi
5000........340/360..............363/382 @ 6.1 psi
5500........370/350..............382/371 @ 7.5 psi
6000........375/330..............393/344 @ 8.9 psi

The twin-screw does in fact make more torque at low rpms than the centri. But how useful is it? With a centri I already have no traction in first on the street and the only time my motor is below 3800 rpms (the cross-over point of power from the twin-screw to the centri) is on launch. I really don't think the stress the low end torque puts on the rods is worth it.

Thanks for this Eagle! From these numbers it looks like I'd be happy with a Vortech. Reps to you man!

stal94gt · February 2nd, 2012, 07:10 AM

stock motor with a vortech, 10# of boost

same vortech with 16# of boost, built motor and ported heads

twin screw power curve, sorry dont have a dyno of a low hp twin screw, and this is on a 4v

imo they are both fun, flooring the car below 3k is a waste of gas so i drop it down no matter what powers my car.

glittle75 · February 2nd, 2012, 08:39 AM

I love my KB, its lots of fun on the street. The difference is where the torque is, KB is off-idle instant full boost, and all the torque is there right then. Centri's spool and then usually make more peak HP. So far as your original post, and wanting all of it right when you hit the gas, Twin Screw or Roots is the way to go for you. Centri is the way to go if your car spends alot of time in the upper RPMs. I would say ride, or if you can drive, friends cars with both style blowers and see which you really want. Wanted a Procharger for the longest time, then rode in a KB Mach, and was sold. No centri's for me.

February 1st, 2012, 09:50 PM	#1
IsaidWOT Enthusiast 2002 Mustang GT Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Grand Rapids, MI Posts: 806 iTrader: 0 reviews	Plans for fun street car My original plan was for a Vortech unit, but upon further research, it won't provide a nice punch down around 2,000 rpms. That's what I'm looking for, riding at 2k and punching it and having massive torque. Is a twin screw the way? __________________ 2002 Mustang GT \| Short Throw Shifter \| CAI \| 3.73 Gears \| Exedy Mach 400 Clutch

February 1st, 2012, 09:55 PM	#2
SSG Pate Premium Member 00 Mustang GT Vert/88 5.0 Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Tennessee Posts: 1,766 iTrader: 3 reviews	Your not going to get MASSIVE torque out of these small cube engines, but a Roots style blower will definately come on stronger then a centrifugal blower will at low boost, but somewhere around 3800RPM better watch out for the centris.. Are you planning a forged block? if so once you get in high boost levels i think the centris and roots are comprable especially if you have the right gearing. __________________ Proud Iraq and Afghanistan War veteran Powered By MMR 4.75L Stroker, Tuned at Kurgan Motorsports

February 1st, 2012, 10:17 PM	#5
IsaidWOT Enthusiast 2002 Mustang GT Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Grand Rapids, MI Posts: 806 iTrader: 0 reviews	I was comparing torque curves and the Kenne bell had a lt of torque at 2,000 rpm. That's what I'm looking for. I may want more power later, but I think the non-ic kit is looking like its what I want for now. I won't have the money for anything more. __________________ 2002 Mustang GT \| Short Throw Shifter \| CAI \| 3.73 Gears \| Exedy Mach 400 Clutch

February 1st, 2012, 10:18 PM	#6
zinc-vert02 Bringing Yellow Back 2002 mustang gt 12.2 at 117 Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: WISCONSIN Posts: 9,967 iTrader: 1 reviews	lol do what i did and put a 3v 5.4 in ti with a roots blower thats a ton of torqe lol but yea a roots blower __________________ SOON TO BE 5.4 3V POWERD WITH A ROUSH CHARGER HELPING IT BAMA Performance Drag Team Member #4

February 1st, 2012, 10:28 PM	#8
mdb12002 Regular 2002 Mustang GT 11.56@119.24 Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: Norfolk, VA Posts: 159 iTrader: 0 reviews	You are going to run into issues if you dont build the motor, and have all that torque at lower end rpms. I recommend putting a forged shortblock in there, good luck though! __________________ Just your average '02 GT Stock bottom end Slower than yours 459rwhp/415tq

February 1st, 2012, 10:02 PM	#4
95mustangGT/SVT Enthusiast 2001 Gt Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: PA Posts: 915 iTrader: 0 reviews	I may be mistaken but I believe that the on3 turbo kit kicks in pretty hard in the 2.3-3k range

February 1st, 2012, 10:40 PM	#9
IsaidWOT Enthusiast 2002 Mustang GT Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Grand Rapids, MI Posts: 806 iTrader: 0 reviews	Would there be a lot of heat even if I keep out of the boost? And also, how bad would it wear on my stock bottom end with 6psi? __________________ 2002 Mustang GT \| Short Throw Shifter \| CAI \| 3.73 Gears \| Exedy Mach 400 Clutch

February 1st, 2012, 10:47 PM	#10
JerseyTrueBlue Hardcore Enthusiast 2001 Mustang GT Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: New Jersey Posts: 1,857 iTrader: 3 reviews	Guys before you start telling this dude to get a shortblock please read the other thousands of threads just like this. We all know that 400whp is safe in any fi application as long as you're intercooled or using meth, your boost levels don't surpass 10-11 psi and you keep your timing under 14 degrees. It's all about cylinder pressure/heat. So lower you're boost while cooling your IAT's at the same time by adding an intercooler. If you are talking about a 6psi non intercooled kit that is plenty safe. My guess is you'd be somewhere around 350whp with that setup, however you could get much more power/boost and be a lot safer by spending the extra cash on the intercooled kit. If you don't want to blow up your car don't cut corners when building an FI motor! Enough said! __________________ True Blue Crew Member #2 315's Crew Member (Dat azz) 255/298 Founder of the please leave my signature alone, I want it to say what I put there and don't appreciate you deleting it club

February 1st, 2012, 11:07 PM	#13
cschoening09 Hardcore Enthusiast 2001 Mustang GT 9.30 @ 77mph-1/8th mile 2.2 60' Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Council Bluffs, IA Posts: 1,705 iTrader: 3 reviews	i think he was meaning if the op were to go above and beyond the 350 whp and build the engine to support more boost/power. therefore if he wants more power than what the stock bottom end can handle, he needs to build his engine and build it right.(not cutting corners).that is if he doesnt want its to blow - correct me if im wrong Jerseyblue __________________ 01 GT. 5spd , 03-04 cobra clutch, on its 2nd 4.6l motor2nd tr3650 too,JLT CAI,UPR o/r x, magnapack catback, predator tuned, H&R ss 10.5" bullitts w/ nt555r DR's

February 1st, 2012, 11:10 PM	#14
T-Lee. 30 I Post Entirely Way Too Much 03 gt, 96 tbird, 05bv gxp Faster than trolls! Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: United States! Posts: 5,275 iTrader: 0 reviews	Centri and gears.... nah good luck with the hunt/decision __________________ 03 V1 S trim @5psi 339/359 3:73's Iraq and Afghanistan War Vet 4 deployments from 01-08.My Wife is also a War Vet

February 1st, 2012, 11:44 PM	#15
Eagle2000GT I Post Entirely Way Too Much 2000 Mustang GT 12.73@111.36 Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Shelbyville, IN Posts: 5,312 iTrader: 1 reviews	I've compared dynos from a KB and my ProCharger. Here are the results. RPM.........KB @ 8 psi.........ProCharger 2500........165/345..............150/300 @ 1.8 psi 3000........200/355..............180/315 @ 2.6 psi 3500........240/360..............230/345 @ 3.4 psi 4000........275/362..............278/365 @ 4.2 psi 4500........310/362..............323/378 @ 5.0 psi 5000........340/360..............363/382 @ 6.1 psi 5500........370/350..............382/371 @ 7.5 psi 6000........375/330..............393/344 @ 8.9 psi The twin-screw does in fact make more torque at low rpms than the centri. But how useful is it? With a centri I already have no traction in first on the street and the only time my motor is below 3800 rpms (the cross-over point of power from the twin-screw to the centri) is on launch. I really don't think the stress the low end torque puts on the rods is worth it. __________________ ProCharger P-1SC, 9 psi, STD 396/383; Uncorrected 388/375; SAE 383/370 Mods list in Garage.

February 2nd, 2012, 07:10 AM	#19
stal94gt I Post Entirely Way Too Much 2003 mustang v6 ;) slow Join Date: May 2010 Location: eglin afb florida Posts: 10,197 iTrader: 2 reviews	stock motor with a vortech, 10# of boost same vortech with 16# of boost, built motor and ported heads twin screw power curve, sorry dont have a dyno of a low hp twin screw, and this is on a 4v imo they are both fun, flooring the car below 3k is a waste of gas so i drop it down no matter what powers my car. __________________ bone stock from the factory!

February 2nd, 2012, 08:39 AM	#20
glittle75 Enthusiast 2003 Mach 1 Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: NC Posts: 726 iTrader: 0 reviews	I love my KB, its lots of fun on the street. The difference is where the torque is, KB is off-idle instant full boost, and all the torque is there right then. Centri's spool and then usually make more peak HP. So far as your original post, and wanting all of it right when you hit the gas, Twin Screw or Roots is the way to go for you. Centri is the way to go if your car spends alot of time in the upper RPMs. I would say ride, or if you can drive, friends cars with both style blowers and see which you really want. Wanted a Procharger for the longest time, then rode in a KB Mach, and was sold. No centri's for me. __________________ 2003 Azure Blue Mach 1 - KB, Suspension, Bolt-ons. 497hp, 460tq.

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