[03_StangGuy]

Originally Posted by beefmobile Guys, don't be fooled by the lame, liberal BS that is trying to pull this country from it's roots. Am i saying that criminal activity doesn't go on? Of course not! But demonizing the world of guns and their owners is pathetic and childish. So, with that said, go out and enjoy some good 'ole shooting at the range and do it safely and responsibly. If you get tired of the gun you have, sell or trade it! To a law abiding, American citizen.

Demonizing the world of guns and gun owners? WOW! The media embellished another story, BIG SURPRISE! The story, as I see, is sayin the same thing as you, sell your guns to law abiding citizens. How do you know the person your selling your gun to is a law abiding citizen, just from their looks?

[beefmobile]

Originally Posted by 03_StangGuy Demonizing the world of guns and gun owners? WOW! The media embellished another story, BIG SURPRISE! The story, as I see, is sayin the same thing as you, sell your guns to law abiding citizens. How do you know the person your selling your gun to is a law abiding citizen, just from their looks?

First, if they've got a Texas CHL, they are a law abiding citizen. Any warrants or pending legal action (besides stuff like traffic violations, etc) and you CHL is automatically revoked. Not to mention what you have to go through in order to get it your CHL...

And if they don't have a CHL, i require to look at their DL. No, that doesn't mean much just by looking at it, but i always, always, always do a bill of sale when buying/selling a gun. here's is a preview of what i use:



That pretty much covers your ass. This is what i mean by buying/selling responsibly. No, you will never stop crime or criminals completely.....ever....get over it

[Imran]

I have heard from many Texas LEO's that bills of sales are useless, and wont help anyone's case. In fact, they dislike them so much that they won't buy or sell to anyone who wants to do a bill of sale, as since it is useless, they are just giving away private information.

[beefmobile]

Originally Posted by Jakashh I have heard from many Texas LEO's that bills of sales are useless, and wont help anyone's case. In fact, they dislike them so much that they won't buy or sell to anyone who wants to do a bill of sale, as since it is useless, they are just giving away private information.

look at the BOS i posted.....that's basically what's in a 4473.

[Imran]

Apparently it still doesnt help lol. According to one Texas cop (not a noob cop, either) and also another retired Texas cop, at least.

[beefmobile]

Originally Posted by Jakashh Apparently it still doesnt help lol. According to the cop (not a noob cop, either) and also another retired Texas cop, at least.

right, so absolutely no way to prove who you sold a gun to is better? When some detective comes knocking on your door and says "we have record that you bought a Glock 22 in 2003 from a dealer. It was involved in a murder. We'd like to speak with you for a few minutes".....you'll have a lot of 'splainin to do without some way to prove you don't have it anymore..........

what's an alternative??? oh...that's right...a bill of sale with the DL number, name, address, and phone number of the person you sold it to. Then they can go knocking on his door and have him 'splain what happened next.

[Imran]

Just read the reasoning here. Third poster down is a known LEO, I'm sure he has experience with the matter at hand. I can find more

FTF Sales

"In addition there is a misnomer that if a gun is used in a crime and you were the original purchaser that somehow you can get in trouble if you cant prove what you did with it. This is not the case."

[beefmobile]

Originally Posted by Jakashh Just read the reasoning here. Third poster down is a known LEO, I'm sure he has experience with the matter at hand. I can find more FTF Sales "In addition there is a misnomer that if a gun is used in a crime and you were the original purchaser that somehow you can get in trouble if you cant prove what you did with it. This is not the case."

"I refuse to do a BOS and I will let you see my DL or CHL but not record anything. Period. Don't like it? Sell it to someone else."

ya.....he sounds like a legal expert if i've ever heard one


nope, not saying just because you were the original purchaser of the gun, that if you can't prove how you sold it then by default you're automatically going to jail forever. That's stupid. But if you can show who you sold the gun to, then it's completely off your shoulders.

[Imran]

fear of 18-20 - Page 3

retired LEO

" The BOS will do NOTHING in either of the above instances, since it's not notarized it's therefore not a legal document - period. Unfortunately, there's lots of folks around that THINK they know what they're doing....that don't. So they make folks jump through unnecessary (and useless) hoops. When someone tells you they want a BOS or to copy your DL/CHL, tell them to pound sand and make a note to yourself for future reference that at best, they're fools."

[Imran]

Mas.

Question about buying a tactical rifle....

[beefmobile]

Originally Posted by Jakashh fear of 18-20 - Page 3 retired LEO " The BOS will do NOTHING in either of the above instances, since it's not notarized it's therefore not a legal document - period. Unfortunately, there's lots of folks around that THINK they know what they're doing....that don't. So they make folks jump through unnecessary (and useless) hoops. When someone tells you they want a BOS or to copy your DL/CHL, tell them to pound sand and make a note to yourself for future reference that at best, they're fools."

Jeez are you the LEO nutswinger of the year or what? First of all, do a little research on cops and their statistics. Go to your local range and ask how good cops are with their weapons. Then go to your local concealed handgun license instructor and ask how well cops know gun laws. Then proceed to have several people laugh in your face and let the range officers show you the holes in the roof and floor of the range while they tell you 99% of them are from cops. No, i'm not joking. And no, i'm not saying cops are idiots or that none of them know the law.....but don't depend on them to be the end-all be-all of knowledge and skill. They're not. Sorry to ruin your day. Hell, most cops in texas don't even know what a 30.06 sign is.....think i'm joking...?....ask one. You'll shit bricks.

Go ahead and go on your google searching rant. Doesn't change anything.

[03_StangGuy]

Originally Posted by beefmobile First, if they've got a Texas CHL, they are a law abiding citizen. Any warrants or pending legal action (besides stuff like traffic violations, etc) and you CHL is automatically revoked. Not to mention what you have to go through in order to get it your CHL... And if they don't have a CHL, i require to look at their DL. No, that doesn't mean much just by looking at it, but i always, always, always do a bill of sale when buying/selling a gun. here's is a preview of what i use: That pretty much covers your ass. This is what i mean by buying/selling responsibly. No, you will never stop crime or criminals completely.....ever....get over it

I never said you could or would stop crime, just that making it harder for criminals to operate isnt a bad thing.

Your making them sign a BOS, is it that much harder to meet at a gun shop and do the sale their and have them sign the paper work there?

[beefmobile]

Originally Posted by Jakashh Mas. Question about buying a tactical rifle....

ya it's funny how they're all bashing bills of sale.....hmm..well if you ever go on Texasguntrader.com (i think it's down right now), the site i was talking about earlier that has 100+ guns loaded on it per day, i would say 90% or more of the ads say something to the effect of, "DL and bill of sale is required, and CHL is preferred"

[beefmobile]

Originally Posted by 03_StangGuy I never said you could or would stop crime, just that making it harder for criminals to operate isnt a bad thing.

Nope. Nope. Nope. It's against the law to illegally buy a gun. Making it "more" illegal just makes it harder for the average Joe, aka law abiding citizen, to exercise their 2nd amendment.

Originally Posted by 03_StangGuy Your making them sign a BOS, is it that much harder to meet at a gun shop and do the sale their and have them sign the paper work there?

I'm going to go ahead and assume you've never tried this. I don't know why you think going to a gun shop makes a difference. And if you're referring to having the gun shop make the buyer fill out a 4473, you're incorrect. They won't. Doing a transfer through a dealer requires them to put it in their books and transfer it. In other words, the legal possession of the gun would look like this on paper: Seller -- Dealer -- Buyer. It doesn't work that way. The gun shop will tell you to go kick rocks.

[Imran]

Originally Posted by 03_StangGuy Racist much? Looks arent everything. Ill admit i was niave and didnt even consider they didnt air the people that denied them sales. But besides them saying the couldnt one legally, they didnt look like they were out to do harm. and their intentions were to use the guns for sport.

Because its complete horseshit. He just told the liberal anti-gun media that a .50 can take down a plane. What about old WW2 fighter jets that had .50's mounted on them, firing away at enemy planes. Did one hit from a Browning take down an axis fighter plane?

Doubt it.

All that the asshole is doing is spreading misinformation that makes guns look worse.

[beefmobile]

Originally Posted by Jakashh Because its complete horseshit. He just told the liberal anti-gun media that a .50 can take down a plane. What about old WW2 fighter jets that had .50's mounted on them, firing away at enemy planes. Did one hit from a Browning take down an axis fighter plane? Doubt it.

check your pulse.

[Imran]

Originally Posted by beefmobile ya it's funny how they're all bashing bills of sale.....hmm..well if you ever go on Texasguntrader.com (i think it's down right now), the site i was talking about earlier that has 100+ guns loaded on it per day, i would say 90% or more of the ads say something to the effect of, "DL and bill of sale is required, and CHL is preferred"

That doesn't mean shit. TGT and Texas gun talk helped start each other. Texasguntrader is fucked, full of scams too. The owner has become hard to get in contact with and doesn't even give a shit about his website anymore.

And the nutswinger comment was not needed, as I was stating the views and opinions of others, but if you want to be a fucking childish douche about it, I'd think that multiple LEO's with many years under their belts would have had experiences with bills of sales in which they didn't help their investigations worth shit in order for them all to hate the concept of it so much.

[Imran]

Originally Posted by beefmobile Jeez are you the LEO nutswinger of the year or what? First of all, do a little research on cops and their statistics. Go to your local range and ask how good cops are with their weapons. Then go to your local concealed handgun license instructor and ask how well cops know gun laws. Then proceed to have several people laugh in your face and let the range officers show you the holes in the roof and floor of the range while they tell you 99% of them are from cops. No, i'm not joking. And no, i'm not saying cops are idiots or that none of them know the law.....but don't depend on them to be the end-all be-all of knowledge and skill. They're not. Sorry to ruin your day. Hell, most cops in texas don't even know what a 30.06 sign is.....think i'm joking...?....ask one. You'll shit bricks. Go ahead and go on your google searching rant. Doesn't change anything.

The cops on these forums acknowledge that there are cops like that, however these are LEO's that love firearms and do know about firearms laws as they see it as more of a hobby than something their job requires them to keep.

[Imran]

Originally Posted by beefmobile But if you can show who you sold the gun to, then it's completely off your shoulders.

I believe that it is completely off your shoulders when you tell them that you sold the gun and don't have it anymore.

[beefmobile]

Originally Posted by Jakashh That doesn't mean shit. TGT and Texas gun talk helped start each other. Texasguntrader is fucked, full of scams too. The owner has become hard to get in contact with and doesn't even give a shit about his website anymore. And the nutswinger comment was not needed, as I was stating the views and opinions of others, but if you want to be a fucking childish douche about it, I'd think that multiple LEO's with many years under their belts would have had experiences with bills of sales in which they didn't help their investigations worth shit in order for them all to hate the concept of it so much.

you've resorted to name calling. nice

one thing you may not know: not all cops lead these drama-filled Hollywood 'investigations' you're talking about. In fact, most cops don't even do investigations. If you're going to rely on these vague, biased forum posts from an LEO to make your legal decisions, then do your thang boo boo