[beefmobile]

Ok guys......


some of you may not know, but i am a prior LS1 owner

I am damn near fully bolted. I still get walked by mildly modded camaro's and firebirds.....and, i mean, what's the freaking point? I could pick up a mildly modded LS1 for like between 10-12k, and have the extra 8-10k in MODS! my car is paid off, so, yes, i can do that. i have been going against the grain now for 2 years trying to get my 4.6 N/A to compete w/ the LS1. i no longer see the point. and i'm not even talking about on the 1/4 where one of the most important elements is the driver...no no, i'm talking about on the street from a 40mph roll and i get eaten for lunch.

i am heavily considering selling my car and picking up a LS1 camaro or vette. getting in the 400rwhp range effortlessly sounds sssoooooo appealing.

i am not shooting from the hip here, i have done my research. i have been hanging out with a bunch of GM guys and it's just a so much better way to go. easy, reliable, raw HP.

Don't get me wrong, i love my mustang SO much. if it had the 5.4 4v i would keep it w/o question....but the 4.sux just isnt cutting it for me.

please, if i have been brainwashed please let me know and knock some sense into me.


btw, my performance mods are:

JLT
NSRs
U/D pullies
Mac LTs
O/R X
Stingers
4.10s
CMCV Delete plates
Hurst shifter
GT500 Throttle body
Bama Tune

the SS that continually spanks me has:

LT's
factory upgraded intake
tune
that is all.

[Mickey]

If your car is paid off, you should be saving for a blower...

[Mickey]

send me a PM for your black painted throttle body with pics por favor

[beefmobile]

no F/I on these cars is TOO EXPENSIVE.

again, put the same amount of money in the stang as a, lets say, 2001 camaro SS and....well....refer to first post

[fastregalwe2]

vortech, $3700

[Emay]

It's a 2001 camaro Beef, I'd rather mod a Scion to be honest and I'm coming from chevy product. It's been my sole purchase since I was 17 years old.

I moved over for the cost savings of building this car, a brand new, not used, full creature featured car, in a retro styling - that for relatively cheap can be made to drive and look like nothing else because of the sheer amount of parts available for them. That's not the case with the camaro, there's parts, but everything has a trick, fabrication, or some home grown way to be made to work with the car. Add to it, the engine bay is a total bitch to work in because the motor is so far tucked under the windshield and I'll just pass on it because of that frustration alone. Wiring is a nightmare, poorly documented at best even from Chevy manuals. Lots of different harness routing on same model - same year cars.

Is the mustang a better car stock for stock. No, it really isn't. It's better because of it's following, it's relative newer design, updated technology, and last of all it's ability to sneak up on them camaros when they think their 400 hp is the end all be all of street ownage. We are the underdog powerwise - that's the fun it.

No matter what make and what model you drive there will always be guys making more power. I bought my mustang with one plan on power, flat out supercharger. No questions asked. Others are determined to run all N/A. I been there, not interested, and the world is migrating to F/I in a frenzy.

On an agreeing sort of mentallity, I'd only think your way for 2 reasons. First, is if there is a mint condition low low low low (did I say low) mileage Camaro SS in black with t-tops. Second would be because I was getting in a Z06 and no matter which I got, I'm going to procharger for an F-1 and some 20lbs of boost anyway.

[beefmobile]

erin, i have had a z28 and i know what you mean about the frustration of the retarded engine placement....ever had to change the #8 spark plug?? it's def a bitch.

if were to go to the dark side, it would be pretty much what you described. also, part of my decision is based on the price difference. as stated above, i would see an $8k-10k margin for mods.....given that my ride is paid for.

i have not completely set my mind to an LS1....but it would seem to me to yield much more beneficial performance/money ratio...plus i fell in love w/ f bodies years ago

[Emay]

I understand that, but your also dropping back in years, and that means regular maintenance is coming. Axle seals, universal joints, wheel bearing replacement, suspension squeeks and small item odds and ends that annoy - nickle and diming that is standard with truly driven performance cars with some age, but very much a necessity in the f-body world.

I see your point, your at a crossroads where you have more coin in a older used car. If you were 7-8 years to the future, the same cheapness you talk of for the camaro would hold true for our mustangs in that senerio.

[Mickey]

go LS3

[petyweestraw]

I was Chevy b4.My buddies talked all kinds of shit when i got mine.I didnt get mine cus it was the fastest.Its a mustang.Its the best looking mustang so far in my opinion.I just love my car.Yes it suckes getting beat by an older car but its simple.4.6 vs 5.7.Out leaged on the department.Guy at work talks crap all the time.When i get my camaro ill be faster not just look fast.phhh what ever you cant brag when you dont own it and you drive a minivan lol.Even still me in mine against him in a new camaro i will win.Fucker cant drive.His wife has a six speed maxima and i took him in my spec-v sentra lolWhatever.Fuck the Jones's.If they buy me camaro ill be in one but im buying my stang and thats what i want.Besides Im building a toy and thats what i will use to hand these new camaros thier asses.Gonna suck when a 87 rx7 dusts them off using a 400 hp ls1.

[navyman8903]

stay with the mustangs, GM might not even survive the next few years. Also How many saftey/design flaws/wireing problems do the camaros have?

Go F/I if you want a super fast car. AND REMEMBER THERE IS ALWAYS SOMEONE FASTER THAN YOU!!!!!!!!

If you want to stay all motor then do it and accept your build limits. Or go F/I and make your build limits. It is all up to you. Your car does not have to be done right now.......

[beefmobile]

Originally Posted by Emay I understand that, but your also dropping back in years, and that means regular maintenance is coming. Axle seals, universal joints, wheel bearing replacement, suspension squeeks and small item odds and ends that annoy - nickle and diming that is standard with truly driven performance cars with some age, but very much a necessity in the f-body world. I see your point, your at a crossroads where you have more coin in a older used car. If you were 7-8 years to the future, the same cheapness you talk of for the camaro would hold true for our mustangs in that senerio.

to counter your last point is exaclty mine. as of right now, i can sell the stang, buy an LS1 and have that much to play with. 10 yrs from now, just the car will be work nothing and i still will be slow....didnt go forward very much.

i'm not saying mustangs suck or anything, hell, i'm one of the biggest mustang fans out here....but 'being slow in the fast department' is not why i have my car. i have other cars to go slow....but this is my toy to go FAST. that's it. and no, i'm not going to buy a $500 fox body and shoot for 8.0's in the 1/4....not that route.

[qwik48r]

I dont know why the hell you say every part has a home grown, shade tree trick to it Emay.. Because it doesnt.. the research and aftermarket support for the LSx community is fucking ENORMOUS.. and most of the BEST products are of superb quality. Hell, 07 just got a set of heads with a busted ass plug hole from on of the best most respect companies in the business: Livernois.

shit happens with ANY performance company. For Beefs goal, I'm ALL for getting a LSx powered car.. a set of heads capable of supporting over 470whp with the right cam only cost about $1000.... The SS that is walking him has longtubes and a tune.. the car probably puts down anywhere from 350-360 to the wheels... and if its a 6 speed, it probably already has 373's.

My own SS has ALL the creature comfort I want... leather/power seats, ac, automatic lights (which stangs dont have), Ttops and a banging Monsoon stereo.... It also has a new engine.. that should be putting "around" a 1000 to the wheels with.. and it is completely daily driver friendly... the car is sinister.. in 4th gear, I can roll into the throttle and when boost comes on it will BURN the tires down at around 65mph... it wil also spin in 5th..

beef, I'm all for it.. I will help you build it up too, and I also tune these cars.

I may also have a rear mount turbo for sale with a GT60-1, RB racing pump.. complete. will make around 525whp on a reasonable 6-7psi.

I can build a rear mount for these cars for about $2000...

If SPEED is your goal.. get something with God's engine: the LS1. They can make serious serious deadly serious power on a STOCK bottom end with nothing more than heads/cam... I'm talking 500whp with nothing but afr 205's, fast intake, and a good cam in the 240's...

its SOOO fucking cheap to make power with them..

[beefmobile]

Originally Posted by navyman8903 stay with the mustangs, GM might not even survive the next few years. Also How many saftey/design flaws/wireing problems do the camaros have? Go F/I if you want a super fast car. AND REMEMBER THERE IS ALWAYS SOMEONE FASTER THAN YOU!!!!!!!! If you want to stay all motor then do it and accept your build limits. Or go F/I and make your build limits. It is all up to you. Your car does not have to be done right now.......

as said before, i am a former z28 owner and that car was, by far, my favorite and fastest 4 wheels i've ever owned. i know there is always somebody faster....but i would rather be on the faster than slower side of the food chain

[qwik48r]

yall know where I stand.. I'm not biased at all...













AT ALL..



















okay maybe just a little..




















but not much






















no I'm serious










no I'm sure

















penis.

[ia07gt]

ok beef im gonna give you all the support i can take the info or dont but read and fully understand.
1. the mustang gt looks 10x better than the camaro
2. if you wanna be cheap on smokin a car with over a 1000cc's more than you then add nitrous
3. I smoke camaros for breakfast(4.6)
4. u could smoke camaros for breakfast
5. u buy a camaro i will smoke you

[beefmobile]

quick, you are so friggin right. i have been surrounding myself w/ LS1 guys for a while now and i have been in denial as well. i need to go back to the dark side.

and you are right. on those mods he was putting down 351 on a low-reading dyno.

and i don't agree w/ the idea of having to Jimmy Rig everything on those motors. as you, said, the LSx industy is ENORMOUS and very very knowledgeable.

my buddy put it this way:

"mustangs are constantly modding to catch up to camaros, but camaros are just modding to catch up to vettes and vipers."

word up.

[beefmobile]

Originally Posted by ia07gt ok beef im gonna give you all the support i can take the info or dont but read and fully understand. 1. the mustang gt looks 10x better than the camaro 2. if you wanna be cheap on smokin a car with over a 1000cc's more than you then add nitrous 3. I smoke camaros for breakfast(4.6) 4. u could smoke camaros for breakfast 5. u buy a camaro i will smoke you

1. i dont agree
2. if it takes nitrous to beat a camaro, what if the camaro adds nitrous?
3. im sure you do, but again, what if you procharge a camaro?
4. see 3
5. wanna put money on it?

[ia07gt]

Originally Posted by qwik48r yall know where I stand.. I'm not biased at all...

well qwik there is something that the camaro cant do on a stock bottom end and that is outperform a cobra with stock bottom end and mods dollar for dollar a 03-04 cobra will kick the shit out of the SS.

[ia07gt]

btw the camaros procharger system doesnt add as much power as the mustangs just a little fyi