[57Merc]

Hey everyone. Like to intro myself. I'm an old fart whos been drag racing for over 35 years. I still race a 800+hp 545 c.i BBF, have a 427sideoiler stroker, a 03 Cobra with mild mods and a old F-250 with stout 460 using left over race parts. One thing they all have in common (except the Cobra) is they're all NA carbed engines. With all that said, I've got a 17 year old son thats been wrench'n with his old man since he was little. So if he keeps his nose clean within reason, I bought him a V6 96 stang a month ago that will be his graduation present. I got it cheap because the clutch was out and in the last month we've replaced the clutch, real duals with a summit 2.5" cat back, painted it and put some 9" front 255's and 10.5" back 275's 17" wheels with 3:73 posi. Now that its look'n good, yesterday I picked up a 2001 splitport motor with 107,000 on it from a friend that ran good. So heres the plan on a 3 grand budget. First freshen the bottom end. Bore, line hone and good rod bolts. The engine kit I was looking at was from RPM a little over $600 less cam. $400 for block machine work (bore, line hone, boil, cam brg's, crank cleaned up etc.). I figured we'd do some porting on the heads and lower intake ourselves. $415 for a VAP windstar kit, $100 LS6 springs and GT retainers, $300 gaskets, oil, plugs & wires and $185 for a good valve job. Now I'm about 2 grand into the motor. I know I'll need to mod the fuel rails $$$$??, but I can't see that being much. So Heres my question to all you V6 guru's. First is the cam. I think the motor has 21# injectors and in the end I'd like to get 230 to 240HP at the wheels. Will those injectors support a cam that will get me that HP? Comp off the shelf stuff seems to have lobe centers that would require a custom tune. Really, the only guy around here wants $350 for a sct chip with a guessed tune and another $400 for a dyno tune. Thats $750 vs $269 with AM's standard stuff. I talked to AM and they said their chip programs are not meant for motors with cams. I was looking at spending my last thousand $ on the cam, chip, roller rockers and a CAI with some homemade ram air. Do or will I need a dyno tune? 114+ lobe centers so the ECM won't freak out? Any help you guys can give would sure help. Thanks Greg

[Rich J]

A handheld tuner from AM should work fine, they probably told you that because their tuner of choice (BAMA) probably doesn't have much experience with tuning a cammed v6. Look into VMP or trick tuners for a tune on a cammed v6. (I JUST learned about this myself lol) The mail order tune should be able to hold you over for a while, but to get even more use out of the cam I would hit the dyno. Also get the sct handheld tuner, not the chip. That way you can pull engine codes and data log. Also you can recieve new tunes via e-mail rather than have to send the chip out and wait.

Hope I helped a little, and Welcome to MM

[57Merc]

Thanks. I went to VMP's site. I'll call them Monday to see if a generic tune will get it running for a while. Still wondering if I need injectors. Looking around at injector sizing formulas online they seem to be all mover the place. Some say 21#'s will support 225rwhp. Then another will say 21's will do 250rwhp. I even saw a formula that said I needed 30#'s.

[v6kid]

I was taught that a general rule was each pound will support 2 hp so 21# x 2hp x 6(injectors) = So they will support about 252 hp, that will be crank not wheel.. I would say to upgrade them, so they aren't working full duty cycle.

[rfcsoulja]

If your lookin for a tune for your cam, I'd go to joe and Trick Tuners. I'm not too impressed with my vmp tune right now.

[v6kid]

I'm still going to say that cams deserve dyno time.

[57Merc]

I guess I'm fighting dyno time being old school and all. Seems some of my track buddies like to brag about dyno numbers, but to me its less $$ in the motor to check for oil leaks and timing. My dyno has been the track and reading the plugs. But I'm sure you are correct that it would be worth it in the end to get the A/F where it needs to be for max power. Still to start with I just want the tune as close as possible with decent power and if my son want to bring it to the dyno later for a fine tune he can. To Mr V6kid............do you know if I can use 24# off a continental 32v 4.6? Seems that would get me there on the cheap.

[9986paulk]

I would get a dyno tune. It really shouldn't take that long though to warrant a $400 charge. That's all they wanted to tune my cammed, supercharged engine.

And as for a company, I would go with trick tuners if you're just getting a base tune for it or even a datalogging one. My experience with VMPs tuning didn't go too well either. Not only did it take him forever to respond to emails (weeks) , but the tune wasn't very close and he didn't have adaptive learning turned off like I'm told it should have been. I do have issues though with mine.

Now, as for the lobe center angle, just pick what you really plan on the car being used for. Even a 110 shouldn't cause you any problems from most peoples' experience. I'm just one of those exceptions that has everything go wrong, so probably not everything I say about setups like this is accurate.

Good luck with everything though! Should make your son very happy!

As for injectors, yes, just upgrade them now. I'd recommend just going with 03/04 cobra 39/42#. They will hold a lot more power than an NA setup will ever make. To avoid fuel rail modding, if you are swapping a whole engine from a 99-04 V6, you could just switch to a 99-04 style fuel pump. Might as well go with a Focus 310 pump, since you seem like you're into building it.

[clidefr0g]

sounds like it will be a really nice car.

[57Merc]

Thanks again guys for all your help. I went to trick tuners site and I'll give Joe a call. It's like going in for a root canal for me with this tuning stuff. It's like I got a preditor for my cobra and it seemed worthless except for shutting the traction control off. I even ran a 7.88 at over 93mph in the 1/8 (no traction) with a stock tune and with their max tune the car gained 2 hundreths and a 1/2 a mph for a $400 handheld. Now it seems I can build a motor that has the potential to 275+ fwhp for less than $2500 but I have to spend around a 1/3 of of that to get it tuned right. It just buggs me I guess. Thats why there just ain't no subtitute for cubic inchs!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[99 BLUE V6]

welcome to MM got pictures of all those cars.

[v6kid]

You could try to tune it yourself if you get a wideband A/F gauge and a handheld....as for the injectors i don't know.

[57Merc]

Is there a way to upload pic's straight from my puter? Added the Cobra to my Avatar

[mcqueen]

Originally Posted by 57Merc Is there a way to upload pic's straight from my puter? Added the Cobra to my Avatar

Gotta upload to a site like Photobucket. We can't upload straight to the forum.

[57Merc]

[57Merc]

OK...........I'm a Photo bucket dumb a**. Help!!!!!!!!!

[57Merc]

Hope this works..................testing 123

[57Merc]

http://i780.photobucket.com/albums/y...c/P1010196.jpg
Wow...............the link works. This is my race car. 545 stroker with a Lincoln 460 2 bolt block. 800+ FWHP (calculated). 3850#'s. Best 1/8 to date 6.59 @105.1. Best 1/4 10.27 @ 131.4. I'll put a link to my wifes car next.

[Rich J]

Alright, when you upload a picture it should give you a "direct link". Copy that link and put it in the post with [img] [/ img] wrapped around it. Or just click on the little icon right above where you type with the picture of the mountains with the sun, its yellow and square. Paste the link there and hit ok.

[57Merc]

My wifes 91 5.0. 3:73's, shift kit and a K&N. She thinks its fast. I'll take a pic of the 96 Stang as soon as I can and also one of my 57 Ranchero with a stroker 427 sideoiler/4spd.