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post #1 of 18 Old May 29th, 2014, 07:21 PM Thread Starter
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it worthwhile to step up injector size

I'm not planning on making a lot of changes but would like to get a little improvement in Idle , MPG and a small amount of pep out of my 2.3 . So far all I've done is a Speedway header and full 2 1/2" exhaust . Only plans aside from maintenance is underdrive pully's and CAI . If I can upgrade my 21 year old injectors , knowing which way to go now would be a good thing . I thought of Bosch 14lb or 17lb . Some say stock is 14 , others say 15 . Can't be much of a difference . The question is will 17lb injectors help or will it not matter as long as they are newer , better inj . Ford Focus injectors are 17lb Bosch . You can get remanufactured and flow matched 14lb fuel injectors for about $70 or un-tested 17lb Focus ones for $20-$50 used . In the end I may get it tuned on a Dyno if I don't procrastinate as usual . Any thoughts ?
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post #2 of 18 Old May 29th, 2014, 07:27 PM
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The ecu is setup stock for the 14's, it will react best to them. 15# will adapt pretty quickly and you might not even notice a difference. The 17's will run rich at startup. The ecu will learn to use them properly as you drive, except for at wide open situations, where it will run a little rich. I would suggest a set of 15's, and make sure they have a four hole nozzle.

1991 Mustang LX 2.3L 5 Speed convert
1989 Ranger 4X4 2.5L 5 Speed solid Dana 30 front axle, 4.5" suspension lift, 3" body. ( blown up....)
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post #3 of 18 Old May 29th, 2014, 07:36 PM Thread Starter
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They are four hole but 14lb . They call them 14lb . From what I've read stock on a 93 is 15 . If they are 14.5lbs you could call them either one up or down . Of course depending on who you speak to . Po-ta-toe , po-ta-to .

---------- Post added at 06:36 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:33 PM ----------

By the way , I really hate cars that run rich . Too many problems pop up when it starts to be too temperamental . (temper or mental) nither one is a good thing .
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post #4 of 18 Old May 29th, 2014, 08:36 PM
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All mustangs have 14#, the 15# ones weren't used in a lima motor until the 2.5 I think.

1991 Mustang LX 2.3L 5 Speed convert
1989 Ranger 4X4 2.5L 5 Speed solid Dana 30 front axle, 4.5" suspension lift, 3" body. ( blown up....)
Entire turbo kit waiting to be used again.
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post #5 of 18 Old May 29th, 2014, 09:58 PM Thread Starter
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So running the 15lb's may be an upgrade and should not cause much of a problem to run ? The Ranger would not have Bosch would it .

---------- Post added at 08:58 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:34 PM ----------

They list the Ranger as 14lb too . They are selling them as the same injectors . 2.3 and 2.5 get the same ones . Guess the upgrade in in the four hole . Except that how would the 2.5 run lowering to 14lb .
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post #6 of 18 Old May 29th, 2014, 10:30 PM
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The 2.5 should have a different part number, I have both at home and they are not the same. This would only be from 98-01. The 15 lb ones will run good, its not much of a change. Another thing that you could do, is buy an adjustable fuel pressure regulator, and set the no vacuum fuel pressure at 45-50 the 14lb injectors would become 15# and have a better atomization of the fuel.

1991 Mustang LX 2.3L 5 Speed convert
1989 Ranger 4X4 2.5L 5 Speed solid Dana 30 front axle, 4.5" suspension lift, 3" body. ( blown up....)
Entire turbo kit waiting to be used again.
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post #7 of 18 Old May 29th, 2014, 11:06 PM Thread Starter
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Good to know about the regulator . What I meant about the injectors is that the people that are selling them do not make a distinction between the two . They are selling 14 pounders for both engines . After reading what you have to say I'm leaning toward the 14lb Bosch . The regulator can wait for now . Thanks loads for your input .
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post #8 of 18 Old May 30th, 2014, 12:13 PM
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No problem! You can get the regulator for $30 on eBay, I bought two, and haven't used them yet, I haven't sat down and made an adapter yet.

1991 Mustang LX 2.3L 5 Speed convert
1989 Ranger 4X4 2.5L 5 Speed solid Dana 30 front axle, 4.5" suspension lift, 3" body. ( blown up....)
Entire turbo kit waiting to be used again.
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post #9 of 18 Old May 30th, 2014, 01:10 PM
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To add onto what Mike said, the stock 14 lb injectors are fine for a bone stock engine that you want toĒ limitĒ HP on; and limit you will. If you spend time tuning on a dyno, one quickly realizes the relationship between HP/engine speed and injector size. No matter how you slice it, you need "X" amount of fuel to create "XĒ amount of HP and with 14 lb injectors and 9:1 compression, that means your stuck at 100ish HP, barely enough to climb a steep hill.

Brake specific fuel consumption for 2.3's with 9:1 compression, averages between .5 - .53 lbs per HP/Hour at peak torque under load. Those are ideal test conditions at best and probably not what your average engine is achieving. If you are running a milled head/ decked block and have ring and vale sealing that is optimal, this number can fall dramatically. Iíve seen brake specific fuel consumption as low as .42lbs. on a high compression 2.3 engine. This means the engine would be producing more HP from less fuel and why Iíve always been a proponent of more compression for 2.3ís.

If youíre changing injectors, I would migrate away from the stock ones and opt for the newer style 4 hole injectors from a Contour SE V-6. At 43 PSI they flow about 16.5 lbs per HR. Atomization is far better with these and tuning can be accomplished via fuel pressure regulation if you canít spring for a tuner.


TVS Supercharged SVO 2.7L

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post #10 of 18 Old May 30th, 2014, 02:40 PM Thread Starter
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I am going to use the 4 hole style Bosch injectors . Just for the sake of a smoother running motor . It does not idle bad now, it's pretty smooth . But it is an older style 4 . I thought I might run 4.10's but not till after I make the changes I have planned and see how it runs . I would not want to be spinning too high RPM's .
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post #11 of 18 Old March 3rd, 2015, 10:18 AM Thread Starter
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I went with the 2000up Ford Focus 17lb Bosch 4 hole injectors . Refurbished and flow matched within 2% of one another . Ran rough right from install and just one day later it's running smoother than ever . Mind you I also installed new plugs , wires and coils . It feels a little peppier from a dead stop and when passing on the highway . Hopefully it will get better gas mileage or at least stay the same . Last time I checked it was about 25hwy . No idea of city miles . Still gathering parts for a 5spd swap but I may do the JY UDP soon just so I get something done by spring/summer .

93 2.3n/a Speedway header and full 2 1/2" exhaust. Flow matched 17lb Bosch 4 hole injectors Junk Yard UDP Air Silencer Delete 5spd (SVO) Trans Swap, Escort 1.9 Flywheel & Aerostar Aluminum Driveshaft 3.73 rear
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post #12 of 18 Old March 6th, 2015, 08:31 PM
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The 17 lb. injectors seem to be a good match when you add other modifications to a 2.3, like compression, exhaust or a mild cam, but ultimately, a tuner like the Moates system or a stand-alone will give you the best results. You can also affect fuel trims by using an adjustable regulator.


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post #13 of 18 Old March 7th, 2015, 08:00 AM Thread Starter
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Right now I'm waiting for a warmer day (over 12* at least) to do the junk yard UDP's . I'll clean them up and shoot a couple of coats of black while I wait . Might try picking up a 2.5 head and get it done before summer . But the fuel regulator was offered up as a good idea before . I think it might have been you OHC230 .

Questions . Leave the stock fuel pump alone ? It's 22 years old . May have been changed but I wouldn't know . What psi to set the regulator at in it's present form ?

93 2.3n/a Speedway header and full 2 1/2" exhaust. Flow matched 17lb Bosch 4 hole injectors Junk Yard UDP Air Silencer Delete 5spd (SVO) Trans Swap, Escort 1.9 Flywheel & Aerostar Aluminum Driveshaft 3.73 rear
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post #14 of 18 Old March 18th, 2015, 06:06 PM Thread Starter
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OHC230 is this the regulator your talking about ?



All over ebay for around $23.00. If it is what would I be adj the pressure to ? Mikel89us said
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set the no vacuum fuel pressure at 45-50 the 14lb injectors would become 15# and have a better atomization of the fuel.
But that was for the 15lb ones and these are 17lb.

93 2.3n/a Speedway header and full 2 1/2" exhaust. Flow matched 17lb Bosch 4 hole injectors Junk Yard UDP Air Silencer Delete 5spd (SVO) Trans Swap, Escort 1.9 Flywheel & Aerostar Aluminum Driveshaft 3.73 rear
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post #15 of 18 Old March 25th, 2015, 02:22 PM
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That should work. It might be worth your while to look at an inexpensive wide-band sensor and gauge, to fine tune things.
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post #16 of 18 Old March 25th, 2015, 06:37 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks OHC230, but what psi should I start at? What wide-band sensor ? Wouldn't the gauge on the regulator be enough to set it? ? Like this ?



Apsx D2 Digital Wideband O2 afr Controller Gauge Sensor Kit Black Blue | eBay

It says you can plug in your laptop and will work with megasquirt .

There are sensors w/o gauges for much cheaper . I'm assuming they replace the oxygen sensor .

---------- Post added at 06:37 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:18 PM ----------

So the sensor will enable me to set the fuel pressure to closest correct setting for the injectors and exhaust that are in the car now? I took a quick look on youtube just now.

93 2.3n/a Speedway header and full 2 1/2" exhaust. Flow matched 17lb Bosch 4 hole injectors Junk Yard UDP Air Silencer Delete 5spd (SVO) Trans Swap, Escort 1.9 Flywheel & Aerostar Aluminum Driveshaft 3.73 rear
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post #17 of 18 Old March 25th, 2015, 06:38 PM
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You use the wide band as a check. You can use the fpr to set the pressure, and run the wideband kit to check the actual air fuel ratio. The stock sensor creates a constant wave form when its operating properly. They are hard to read for tuning purposes. You use the wide and to check your air fuel ratio under power, it should be somewhere close to 12.5:1 wide open hard running. If it runs leaner (above 12.5:1) you would add some fuel pressure to get a bit more fuel and make the proper power it's capable of. If its rich((less than 12:1) you would take some pressure out. You do not want to drop the pressure much, anything less than 35psi would cause insufficient fuel atomization. You leave your stock oxygen sensor in because it will automatically adjust for proper cruising air fuel ratios on its own. Once you get to heavy loads, the computer ignores the oxygen sensor and runs off the base map, which will cause lean or rich problems with improper flow rates.

1991 Mustang LX 2.3L 5 Speed convert
1989 Ranger 4X4 2.5L 5 Speed solid Dana 30 front axle, 4.5" suspension lift, 3" body. ( blown up....)
Entire turbo kit waiting to be used again.
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post #18 of 18 Old March 25th, 2015, 07:27 PM Thread Starter
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So that regulator and wideband are good to use ? It's running much better than it used to but I'm sure their is a little bit more room for improvement.
If I sell another $500 comic on ebay I will move along a little faster .

---------- Post added at 07:27 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:11 PM ----------

This has nothing to do with this but I was wondering why Zonker said "IMPORTANT NOTE 1: Regarding the belt routing on the 2 belt setup... when using the ranger crank pulley, do not run both belts on the crank! Only the outer (smaller) pulley should have the belt on it, the inner belt goes to WP - PS - alt only!"
Well I found out. I had the new belts but reused the old belt and no power increase. Swapped to the new shorter belt and big difference . Good mod.

93 2.3n/a Speedway header and full 2 1/2" exhaust. Flow matched 17lb Bosch 4 hole injectors Junk Yard UDP Air Silencer Delete 5spd (SVO) Trans Swap, Escort 1.9 Flywheel & Aerostar Aluminum Driveshaft 3.73 rear
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