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post #1 of 16 Old April 24th, 2016, 08:21 PM Thread Starter
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Planning the motor build

Getting ready to start pulling the trigger on some items to start my engine build, and wanted to get some opinions and advice.

My plans are for a 500rwhp car, maybe mid 500's down the road....

Plans are to pick up a low mile cobra shortblock and utilize stock 2v heads. I believe this gives me a compression ratio slightly higher than stock 2v numbers.

CMS stage 1 blower cams in stock heads
03/04 Cobra short block
P1 Procharger running 3.2 pulley now, wondering how much smaller I can go before I overspin it. Definitely plan on sending the P1 in to get upgraded to a D1.

Obviously new oil pump and timing components will go in, any advice on which oil pump?

Thinking about an 8 rib kit as well.


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post #2 of 16 Old April 24th, 2016, 08:34 PM
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Dont matter which oil pump cause the 2V housings are the same its the gears your looking for so as long as you have billet gears you'll be just fine.

8 rib kit isn't necessary for 500 RWHP so save your money on that and go after a 15% over drive crank pulley that will square you away.


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post #3 of 16 Old April 24th, 2016, 08:36 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by SSG Pate View Post
Dont matter which oil pump cause the 2V housings are the same its the gears your looking for so as long as you have billet gears you'll be just fine.

8 rib kit isn't necessary for 500 RWHP so save your money on that and go after a 15% over drive crank pulley that will square you away.


Thanks Pate, sounds like sound advice.

You've had tons of experience in the top end of this platform....at what power level should ported heads start being seriously thought about?


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post #4 of 16 Old April 24th, 2016, 08:39 PM
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Thanks Pate, sounds like sound advice.

You've had tons of experience in the top end of this platform....at what power level should ported heads start being seriously thought about?
Thank You I made 550RWHP with bone stock heads and a set of MPH blower cams with my automatic back in the day.


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post #5 of 16 Old April 24th, 2016, 09:30 PM Thread Starter
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Thank You I made 550RWHP with bone stock heads and a set of MPH blower cams with my automatic back in the day.

Thats good news....was that with the vortech? How much boost?


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post #6 of 16 Old April 24th, 2016, 09:48 PM
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I think that was around 18.5PSI if i remember correctly.


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post #7 of 16 Old May 17th, 2016, 05:37 PM Thread Starter
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Just got through moving, and put tires on the wife's car. So parts for this build are going to start coming in next month.

I know I've seen where longtube gains were minimal on an already boosted setup with stock heads/cams. Since I am going to go with a blower cam in the stock heads, would longtubes be worth it?

I'd rather do shorties, but I've read through that debate enough times already lol


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post #8 of 16 Old May 17th, 2016, 08:10 PM
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I would say depends on the primary size of the shorties. I don't see a reason to do long tubes until the percentage of gains is even worth it. I figure until some one is pushing over 600 rwhp there is no reason to switch out.
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post #9 of 16 Old May 17th, 2016, 09:06 PM
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Do shorties.


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post #10 of 16 Old May 17th, 2016, 10:25 PM
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post #11 of 16 Old May 18th, 2016, 10:39 AM
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I might be in the minority here, but I personally think that terminator shortblocks are seldom ever worth the money. If you don't open them up, you have a most likely heavily used bottom end with 10s of thousands of miles on it that comes with the less than ideal Zollner pistons that have pretty tight piston to wall clearance stock (meaning that they have a tendency to expand and scuff your cylinder all to hell during extended high speed pulls).

If you were to do it right, you'd tear it down, hone the block, replace the bearings and rings, and throw in a set of 2618 alloy pistons like Manley, Diamond, Ross, JE, etc. By the time you do that, you would be better off just building it from scratch.

By the way, Romeo's have 17cc dish pistons from the factory. Terminator pistons are 18cc dish. Your compression would actually be a fraction of a point less with the new shortblock.

You need to upgrade to a Cobra pump/pickup tube/billet gear set also. You can throw billet gears in a SOHC oil pump, but they will not flow as much oil as a set of billet gears in a DOHC pump. Don't believe me? Go measure your gears. SOHC gears are .47" wide while the DOHC gears are .51" wide.


What does your dyno sheet trap?
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post #12 of 16 Old May 18th, 2016, 03:26 PM Thread Starter
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Do shorties.

So glad to be steered this direction. Thanks for the nudge!

---------- Post added at 02:26 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:24 PM ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by flyboy1294 View Post
I might be in the minority here, but I personally think that terminator shortblocks are seldom ever worth the money. If you don't open them up, you have a most likely heavily used bottom end with 10s of thousands of miles on it that comes with the less than ideal Zollner pistons that have pretty tight piston to wall clearance stock (meaning that they have a tendency to expand and scuff your cylinder all to hell during extended high speed pulls).

If you were to do it right, you'd tear it down, hone the block, replace the bearings and rings, and throw in a set of 2618 alloy pistons like Manley, Diamond, Ross, JE, etc. By the time you do that, you would be better off just building it from scratch.

By the way, Romeo's have 17cc dish pistons from the factory. Terminator pistons are 18cc dish. Your compression would actually be a fraction of a point less with the new shortblock.

You need to upgrade to a Cobra pump/pickup tube/billet gear set also. You can throw billet gears in a SOHC oil pump, but they will not flow as much oil as a set of billet gears in a DOHC pump. Don't believe me? Go measure your gears. SOHC gears are .47" wide while the DOHC gears are .51" wide.

Thanks for the info flyboy

I've tossed around the idea of building my own shortblock. I feel I am plenty capable, I just don't know of any trustworthy machine shops in my area( North Mississippi).

If I did build my own, with the centri, I'd want to bump compression to 10.5...what are your thoughts?


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post #13 of 16 Old May 18th, 2016, 04:40 PM
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Originally Posted by sonicdan View Post

Thanks for the info flyboy

I've tossed around the idea of building my own shortblock. I feel I am plenty capable, I just don't know of any trustworthy machine shops in my area( North Mississippi).

If I did build my own, with the centri, I'd want to bump compression to 10.5...what are your thoughts?
Do it yourself. There is a ton of literature floating around on how to assemble a shortblock, and no one will do as good of job as you will.

Buying a used, OEM assembled shortblock is not the answer imo and will only lead to headaches .

93 octane or e85? If you want to keep the boost to 15psi or so, do 10.5:1 with a centri. If you are wanting 15-20psi, keep it around stock imo. Unless you are running e85, in which case go high comp or go home.


What does your dyno sheet trap?
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post #14 of 16 Old May 18th, 2016, 08:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flyboy1294 View Post
I might be in the minority here, but I personally think that terminator shortblocks are seldom ever worth the money. If you don't open them up, you have a most likely heavily used bottom end with 10s of thousands of miles on it that comes with the less than ideal Zollner pistons that have pretty tight piston to wall clearance stock (meaning that they have a tendency to expand and scuff your cylinder all to hell during extended high speed pulls).
I have said this many times about cobra shortblocks not to mention if a guy pulls apart his cobra engine it is more than likely hurt. The zollner pistons are marginal at best. Most guys think the cobra blocks came with Manley or mahle pistons

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post #15 of 16 Old May 19th, 2016, 11:33 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by flyboy1294 View Post
Do it yourself. There is a ton of literature floating around on how to assemble a shortblock, and no one will do as good of job as you will.

Buying a used, OEM assembled shortblock is not the answer imo and will only lead to headaches .

93 octane or e85? If you want to keep the boost to 15psi or so, do 10.5:1 with a centri. If you are wanting 15-20psi, keep it around stock imo. Unless you are running e85, in which case go high comp or go home.


I have e85 around me, but it's not prevalent enough to make the switch.

So the plan is stay 93, 15lbs with the centri. I do have thoughts of switching to twin screw down the line....


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post #16 of 16 Old May 20th, 2016, 12:33 AM
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Honestly, your block and crank is good for those numbers. Just need rods and pistons to be steady at 600 hp. If you're on a budget that is.

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