'65 Coupe 351w - Page 44 - Forums at Modded Mustangs
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post #861 of 885 Old May 26th, 2017, 03:22 PM
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I actually really like edelbrock carbs. Anyways its looking really good. Interesting spark setup you have going on. Wouldnt just a better distributor help out better?
They run just okay out of the box. They build them to be a "no hassle" kind of carb. It's like Windows. It work good enough for most but you can't do much with them. They don't get the best mileage and don't make the best power either. Holley, QFT, Proform, AED, etc... are like Linux. They take some tinkering to get them just right but when you get them right, they'll outperform anything else you put up against them.

If it was me, that 351W would have a Holley 850 DP with annular boosters, especially with the dual plane manifold.

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post #862 of 885 Old May 26th, 2017, 06:12 PM Thread Starter
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Do the math based on airflow, a 850 is about 200CFM more than a 351W can pull, even at 7000 RPM.

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post #863 of 885 Old May 26th, 2017, 06:33 PM
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Do the math based on airflow, a 850 is about 200CFM more than a 351W can pull, even at 7000 RPM.
Myth. Don't buy into the garb about carb size. There is no such thing as too big of a carb, only too weak of a booster signal.

The equations are for 40+ years ago when all you had was straight boosters. With todays carbs, you can customize the PV, PVCR, pump cams, secondary springs, change where mechanical secondaries kick in, boosters, etc... to fit whatever you need.

Remember that 4bbl carbs are flow rated at 1.5" of vacuum and 2bbl carbs at 3.0". That means 600 CFM carb only flows 600 CFM when under 1.5" of vacuum. If the intake manifold has 1.5" of vacuum, you're throwing away power pretty significantly. That 600 will start becoming a restriction at around 450 CFM. In the age when you're able to change PVCR and boosters, there's no reason to compromise on the carb size anymore. With annular boosters and a more favorable PVCR and jetting combo, a carb that's 2.5x displacement becomes more favorable. Scrap the 600-650 for a properly built and tuned 850 on that 351w and it'll gain power and response everywhere.

http://www.hotrod.com/articles/0511p...boosters-tech/

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post #864 of 885 Old May 29th, 2017, 11:46 PM Thread Starter
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West Houston Cars and Coffee at Gateway Classics last Saturday:










































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post #865 of 885 Old June 10th, 2017, 03:12 PM Thread Starter
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After bragging about how awesome the car was running after the EDIS upgrade, I went to change the oil last weekend only to realize I had a 8" puddle of oil on the floor. I ran the engine for a bit to discern where it was coming from, and it looked very much like it was coming from behind the balancer. Considering I swapped the balancer when I did the upgrade, that made a lot of sense. I was really dreading pulling the timing cover to change out the front seal, when I found to that you can buy a sleeve for your balancer to "repair it". I decided to pull the balancer and see what the shaft and seal looked like and determine a path forwards.

I managed to get the job done by only pulling the fan, and removing the belts to get the crank pulley and dampener off. As you can see, the oil was definitely collecting on the rim of the timing cover at the seal:





The seal appeared to be in good shape, just not seating tight. I used a caliper to measure the dampener that came with my crate motor and the one from my 351 that I swapped in, and mine was 0.01" smaller. Not a big different, but I was thinking it might be enough. I didn't want to install the ATK dampener back on, because it is 3mm longer, and throws off the alignment of my belts. Luckily Fel-Pro (and a few others) make a sleeve that will "repair" your harmonic balancer shaft for $8. Although mine was perfectly smooth and unblemished, the sleeve did add about .015 of diameter, which appears to be enough. The car is back together and has run for 20 minutes without a drop of oil. Last weekend 5 minute was enough to generate a 4" puddle. Hopefully this holds up long term and I don't have to pull the timing cover.



Now to figure out whey I have a 16" poodle of coolant


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post #866 of 885 Old June 25th, 2017, 10:08 AM
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I hate leaks. they drive me crazy lol. the car is looking good AJ.


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post #867 of 885 Old June 25th, 2017, 03:24 PM Thread Starter
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Still leaking though. Yesterday I changed the front seal, still no luck. I just ordered an endoscope so that I can try to get behind the balancer while it is running and find the source of the leak.

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post #868 of 885 Old July 8th, 2017, 01:20 AM Thread Starter
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So photobucket killed about 75% of automotive forums by taking all of our pictures ransom.

I'm working on what a good alternative LONG TERM solution. I'll let you guys know when I come up with something.

===================
testing
===================

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/s/...nqazh.png?dl=0



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post #869 of 885 Old July 9th, 2017, 03:09 PM Thread Starter
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oops


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post #870 of 885 Old July 9th, 2017, 07:29 PM
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Originally Posted by ajzride View Post
So photobucket killed about 75% of automotive forums by taking all of our pictures ransom.

I'm working on what a good alternative LONG TERM solution. I'll let you guys know when I come up with something.

===================
testing
===================

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/s/...nqazh.png?dl=0

seriously annoyed about this. I had already upgraded my account because of the amount of storage I needed, but it aggravates me none the less


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post #871 of 885 Old July 9th, 2017, 10:57 PM Thread Starter
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You can make dropbox work, but it's not as convenient as photobucket. After you upload a file you have to click on the file and "create a link" for it. Then you have to reformat the link either manually or using a script. Dropbox has 2GB free and then $99/year for more. Far more reasonable than Photobuckets price, plus it can be handy for other things as well. I'm still trying to figure out how to make Amazon Prime photo's work, but I can't figure out a permanent link directly to a file. I've emailed amazon tech support.

I'm avoiding flickr, imgur, and other sites similar to photobucket because I don't want to have then happen again ten years from now. There is no way I could update all the links in this 6 year old thread and make it useful again

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post #872 of 885 Old July 10th, 2017, 08:25 AM
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the real issue is that even if you do find one, or even if you decide to pay there 400.00 blood money, the forum as it is, is going to die. because most of the people who use the forums are not going to do it, and who is going to go back through all there old threads and update them so that they are still useable? I probably won't. I am thinking after this once I get all my images downloaded from photobucket, I am done with forums. it has been a great source of information, and I have enjoyed learning from and helping others by doing writeups on things for years now, but I am not going to go back and try to fix all my old links. and I am not going to pay there 400.00 a year. If they would do a percentage discount say since I use less than 5 gb pay a tenth of there charge, 40 a year, I would probably do it. but at this point I think no matter what they do, photobucket is dead and so are most forums. It was fun while it lasted I guess.


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post #873 of 885 Old July 10th, 2017, 11:12 AM
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Off topic / On topic, try using imgur.com Best hosting site I've found. I threw photobucket to the curb years ago.
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post #874 of 885 Old July 10th, 2017, 11:58 AM Thread Starter
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Off topic / On topic, try using imgur.com Best hosting site I've found. I threw photobucket to the curb years ago.
I have two problems with imgur:

1) the Terms of Service explicitly state no embedding, they don't currently enforce but they could one day
2) I'm concerned about long term stability much like photobucket. That is why I'm looking for a backup site (far more stable) that also supports embedding.

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post #875 of 885 Old August 11th, 2017, 06:29 PM Thread Starter
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Okay, the 351w sold in only 4 days on craigslist. So the cash went straight towards my next project:


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post #876 of 885 Old August 13th, 2017, 12:06 AM Thread Starter
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I must admit that since installing the EDIS system, the car runs really really well. I'm not having any problems with the Edelbrock carb per say, but I think it is still pretty rich. I'm only getting about 8 mpg, and the garage still smell like gas. Plus there is the pain in the butt of cold starting. Since I sold the 351w, I took the money an ordered a Holley Sniper. I had been planning on an FITech for a few years now, but the Sniper was only a few hundred bucks more, and I'm much more confident that Holley will be around in 15 years when I need parts to service this thing. Plus it's made in America.

My overall plans is

Sniper Throttle Body (https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/...?ie=UTF8&psc=1)
Spectre EFI tank with in-tank pump (https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/...?ie=UTF8&psc=1)
Rubber High Pressure feed hose (https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/...?ie=UTF8&psc=1)
Rubber low pressure return hose (https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/...?ie=UTF8&psc=1)
AN Slip on fittings (https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/...?ie=UTF8&psc=1)
AN Crimps (https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/...?ie=UTF8&psc=1)

I chose the rubber hoses over the metal one because I've heard that sometimes it can cause problems with heat build-up. If you order the sniper master fuel kit it comes with full rubber hoses.

I saw a video on youtube where some guys installed a sniper kit in 2 hours and 11 minutes, so I decided to time myself. Tonight I clocked in at 1 hours and 58 minutes... I would guess that I will probably be done with the Sniper install in about 3.5 hours, but I also have to install the new tank, which will take a few hours I'm sure.

Some obstacles I ran into:

It took me 30 minutes just to clean the old gasket off the intake manifold
I had to clearance my throttle cable bracket to fit the Sniper
I had to trim my air cleaner stud
The crappy cheap plastic piece that attaches the cable to mount broke, and i had to glue it back together and secure it with a tie wrap

The throttle body is mounted, the ignition advance and PCV are hooked up, and the throttle cable is working correctly.

Tomorrow I will undertake wiring, and then it will sit until next weekend because I won't have fuel hoses or the new tank until Tuesday.






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post #877 of 885 Old August 13th, 2017, 05:18 PM Thread Starter
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Today's clock: 3 hours 17 minutes
Total clock: 5 hours 15 minutes

No upside down pictures to share, but here is the skinny:

All wiring ran and connected.

I had hidden all the wires in my engine bay, but some of the Sniper stuff is too short to reach the firewall or fender for hiding. I did manage to get the main wiring harness to the passenger fender so that I could hide the relays in the fender well, but that required cutting a 2" hole to get the connector through.

O2 sensor installed and tested

I had to convert my fan from positive trigger to negative trigger to allow the sniper to turn the fan on and off.

I tested the fuel pump wiring, the coolant sensor wiring, and the fan wiring. I used a heat gun to heat the probe until the fan comes on. The throttle position sensor is working well, reads 0-102%.

The only concern I have about wiring is my EDIS, I hooked it up like a tach output from a CD box, that made the most sense to me. If that doesn't work I'll hook it up like a coil.

Later this week I will install the new tank and run the two hoses and test it out.

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post #878 of 885 Old August 14th, 2017, 11:01 PM Thread Starter
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Everything I needed to finish showed up today:

I'm thinking I should run a separate timer for the fuel tank. I spent 12 minutes tonight pulling the pump and putting the filter back on, and I'm sure I'll need ten minutes or so to flatten out the bent corners (thanks FedEx). But the biggest hitter is going to be on me. I made a poor decision when I built my trunk kit, and the piece of carpeted wood that I made the bottom out of runs all the way to the back seat, which means I have to pull the sub/amp box to change the tank. I'm sure this will add at least 2 hours to the job because I have to disconnect all the wiring to the amp, remove some trim pieces, pull the sub box, pull the floor, and then put it all back to change the tank.

Why am I changing the tank instead of just putting an external pump in? 25% more fuel capacity, I upgraded to the 20 gallon tank.



The new Spectre tank gave me an excuse to use my new borescope to check out the inside:









luckily it is clean as a whistle (some on VMF have had issues with gunk) but the filter had fallen off the pump and I had to pull the unit and reattach the filter.

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post #879 of 885 Old August 15th, 2017, 09:35 PM Thread Starter
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Todays Timers:

Gas Tank - 1 hour 29 minutes (still have to modify filler neck and reinstall sub box)
Sniper Install - 1:18 Minutes

Total Timers:

Gas Tank - 1 hour 41 minutes
Sniper Install - 6 hours 33 minutes

Today I swapped the fuel tank and connected the fuel hoses. I wound up taking everyone's advice here and reusing the stock line as the return line. I also had the new high pressure line routed along and strapped to the existing fuel line. Once I reached the engine compartment, I came up behind the steering column tight against the firewall, along the fender wall to the shock tower, and then under the export brace to the manifold. Both the fuel supply and return are on the firewall side of the throttle body.

As a note to anyone else out there, the slip-on AN fittings are a really PITA if you don't soak the hose in hot water to soften them up first, it makes a night and day difference.

After buttoning everything up I fired the motor off and let it run long enough to warm up and kick the fan on. Then I shut it down and checked for fuel leaks. No leaks, fan comes on fan, all the sensors are working. The Sniper handheld shows timings, but it is not controlling the EDIS, the Megajolt is.
New Tank Installed



Half the time on the tank swap was trying to drain the old one out. My drain plug was galled and wouldn't remove, so I had to drain enough out through the pickup until it was light enough to pick up and put out through the filler. I had it sitting on two saw horses draining into a 5 gallon bucket, and I got a huge gust of wind hard enough to knock it off, spilling the bucket in the process:



EPA ain't gonna be happy about that one:



Two videos, one of routing and hookups, another of first start:



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post #880 of 885 Old August 16th, 2017, 05:40 PM Thread Starter
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Well.......

I can't say the guys at VMF didn't warn me. Literally only took 1.3 miles to the gas station and back to damage the soft line under the car. A zip tie rubbed up against the emergency brake bracket and broke loose, letting the hose into the drive shaft:





I ordered the factory pre-bent 3/8 fuel line today, which really was cheaper than the roll of R9, should have just done that in the first place...


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