02SonicGT - Vortech V3 - Treadstone TRV25 Build - Forums at Modded Mustangs
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post #1 of 415 Old February 21st, 2012, 10:40 PM Thread Starter
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02SonicGT - Vortech V3 - Treadstone TRV25 Build

About to take on a loooong awaited project and plan to document it both here and at Trick Tuners as Joe will be providing my tune.



Brief History:



My automotive addiction started in the import world with a 96 Eclipse GS-T (FWD Turbo) that had a 2.0l 4G63 inline 4 cyl. I spent 7 years taking the stock 210hp to the crank to 325hp to the wheels by upgrading the turbo, fuel system, +all supporting boltons, and leveraging a piggy back fuel computer Apex S-AFC to push 21psi through the stock motor on 93 octane with the exception of HKS cams. I performed all tuning on my own in small increments data-logging signals from the ECU in conjunction with various gauges on the car. Don’t smack me, but I used a digital readout on the narrow band coupled with timing advance, EGT’s, STFT and LTFT to tune the car within 5 hp of what a tuner was able to do on the dyno. The best it did in the ľ was 13.7 at 110mph. I had the trap speed but no traction off the line on street tires with a FWD.

It was a huge surprise to me to find out the Ford cars require a Flash and do not leverage the on-the-fly changes possible with a piggy back unit such as the AFC. I purchased my Livewire device prior to knowing this and was rather depressed by what it couldn’t do for the money….



Unfortunately I had to sell the car for a variety of reasons but was fortunate enough to pick up the mustang just a couple years later. Knowing my addiction would eventually lead me down the same path, I created a plan based upon limited funds. Over time I set out to prep the car for some form of forced induction. I liked the idea of getting to know my car prior to cramming air down its throat. My build has been implemented backwards to what most people do in that the Centri is the last thing being installed.



Car info & Driver:



I am 36 years old and drive a Sonic Blue 2002 GT manual with 83k miles on it. I bought it bone stock used 4 years ago with 77k miles. It is my weekend warrior car(I am lucky to have a company car and literally only pull the stang out on weekends) and I plan to run it at the track down the 1/4 maybe 2-3 times a year. I have yet to make it to the track with what is on it now but have made progress with the purchase of a new helmet J.



Parts installed to date:
-FRPP 3.73 gears
-Ram HDX clutch
-Repacked trak-lok clutches
-American muscle Cold air intake
-Professional products 65mm TB (we will visit this again later)
-Professional products upper intake plenum
-SCT livewire with bama tune
-Pypes catback
-Pypes x-pipe with cats
-H&R sport springs
-Tokiko shocks/struts
-Steeda tri-ax
-firewall adjuster
-J&R LCA
-Autometer Gauges in triple pillar mount- volts,psi,WideBand
-Plx-AFR wideband o2 sensor & cable to plug it into Livewire (purchased from Joe) O2 Bung added to driver side just below connection to header.
-17x10.5’s with 315 NT555’s in the rear
-Have already used SCT livelink software to datalog signals



Parts purchased and in the process of being installed:


-Treadstone TRV25 Intercooler with inlet/outlet on opposite ends
-Tial Q 50mm BOV with pink spring
-VMP 75mm blow through MAF housing
-3” intercooler pipes & misc silicone couplers & TBolt clamps
-Valve cover filter (will eventually replace it with a catch can)



Parts that I plan to purchase to complete the build (over the next 2 months):


-Siemans 60lb injectors (From Joe @ tricktuners)
-Tuning Service (From Joe @ tricktuners)
-PMAS HPX MAF & pigtail (From Joe @ tricktuners)
-DivisionX Stryker 340lph fuel pump
-Spark plugs – 1 range colder
-Vortech V3-Si tuner kit 4FL218-150L
-Additional loose pipes/couplers for custom 4” power pipe = 3.5” to 4” 90deg coupler -> 45 deg 4” alum pipe -> 45deg 4” coupler -> 4" long piece of straight pipe (excess cut from 45*) -> filter in fender



Air flow description (picture while facing the car):


1)Re-clock the V3 outlet to about 4 o-clock.
2)Feeds into a 16” straight pipe flanged for the Tial Q
3)Down and around to the right side of the FMIC
4)Outlet of the FMIC on the left down and up through the fender (cut a custom hole) into the VMP MAF housing. FMIC mounted behind the bumper support. I refuse to sacrifice safety for airflow. Cutting the right wing off the left bumper support mount allowed for the unit to be only 1.5” off center which is hardly noticeable.
5)Through a modified CAI pipe
6)Finally to the PP TB and Plenum



Questions:


1)From what I have been reading the Stryker pump should be sufficient without a BAP for what this motor can handle in its stock form. Agree? What about the Walbro TU229HP unit? Can it flow sufficient fuel on its own without a BAP?

2)Will going with the 60lb injectors affect tunability at part throttle?
What size pulley will be needed to hit roughly 10-11psi? The treadstone is a top down unit so it should have little pressure loss.

3)Will the 65mm throttle body have a significant impact to performance numbers?

4)Any flaws in general with what I have laid out? I’ll be proceeding with purchasing the parts in the coming weeks. Wife and Kids take most of my free time so I cram it in when I have time.

Much to follow....


SOLD : 02 Sonic Blue GT - Vortech V3-Si, Treadstone TRV25O, Tial Q, PMAS HPX MAF
SOLD : 14 Ruby Red F150 Ecoboost
15 Mustang GT PP - SCT Tune & Exhaust.
Click Here to see my 02 Vortech V3 Build Thread

Last edited by 02sonicGT; May 16th, 2014 at 07:06 PM.
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post #2 of 415 Old February 21st, 2012, 10:48 PM Thread Starter
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Some pictures of the Treadstone TRV25O installation. I actually fabricated up the unit with cardboard to ensure proper fitment and alignment BEHIND the bumper support. I was not going to sacrifice safety on this build.




Modified the left bumper support by cutting off the ear to allow the 90 degree coupler to fit flush against the side of it. I will be putting rubber trim along it to protect the coupler. This had no negative effect on the strength.


This picture shows the elbow up against the support. I have not trimmed the 90degree coupler yet so may gain another 1/2 inch of a shift. You can also see the black cooling line slightly in this picture. I bent it up and on top of the FMIC.


Where the coupler exits




View from other side. Only about 3/8" of the IC fins are covered by the bumper support.



Nearly centered. I doubt it will be that noticable when it is all back together and I trim a bit of the coupler.



The FMIC will be mounted to the bumper with strips of aluminum screwed into the back of the support and into the FMIC brackets.


Any thoughts on what I have done so far?


SOLD : 02 Sonic Blue GT - Vortech V3-Si, Treadstone TRV25O, Tial Q, PMAS HPX MAF
SOLD : 14 Ruby Red F150 Ecoboost
15 Mustang GT PP - SCT Tune & Exhaust.
Click Here to see my 02 Vortech V3 Build Thread

Last edited by 02sonicGT; December 31st, 2017 at 05:26 PM.
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post #3 of 415 Old February 21st, 2012, 10:59 PM Thread Starter
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Picture of the Treadstone TRV25O out of the box


Hole I cut in the inner fender for the IC piping from the IC outlet to throttle body to travel through



Picture of the Tial Q Bov (pink spring)



SOLD : 02 Sonic Blue GT - Vortech V3-Si, Treadstone TRV25O, Tial Q, PMAS HPX MAF
SOLD : 14 Ruby Red F150 Ecoboost
15 Mustang GT PP - SCT Tune & Exhaust.
Click Here to see my 02 Vortech V3 Build Thread

Last edited by 02sonicGT; December 31st, 2017 at 05:31 PM.
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post #4 of 415 Old February 22nd, 2012, 02:49 PM
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Everything sounds and looks good. Si makes about 10 psi on the stock 3.6 pulley. I think you'll be fine with a 3.48 pulley pulley and Treadstone to make 10psi.

2004 DSG Mustang Mach 1 4r75w - 508/436 on E85. 460/396 on 93. Intercooled Vortech V1 S trim, Circle D 4c converter, BCA valve body, VRS o/r x pipe. 11.37 @ 120.8 mph 1.63 60'
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post #5 of 415 Old February 23rd, 2012, 02:44 PM Thread Starter
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I am still up in the air about the fuel pump. There doesn't appear to be alot of history with the DivsionX stryker unit so I am a little hesitant. I did some searches on the Ford GT pump but am unsure if there is a particular year I should be looking for. RockAuto has them for $189 which isn't bad.

Some have mentioned overheating with the larger pumps and needing to run heavier gauge wire which also picks up a few % DC with the reduced load.


SOLD : 02 Sonic Blue GT - Vortech V3-Si, Treadstone TRV25O, Tial Q, PMAS HPX MAF
SOLD : 14 Ruby Red F150 Ecoboost
15 Mustang GT PP - SCT Tune & Exhaust.
Click Here to see my 02 Vortech V3 Build Thread
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post #6 of 415 Old February 23rd, 2012, 10:39 PM
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I'd like to know a little more on the new walbro pump as well I have heard good things what little I have heard.




2000 Mustang GT-SOLD

2004 Jeep Grand Cherokee

2007 STi Limited 623/800

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post #7 of 415 Old February 24th, 2012, 01:03 PM Thread Starter
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Items I plan to post this weekend for those interested:

1) I am going to use spacers behind the bumper support to pull it out .5 to .75 inches providing an air gap between the radiator and the treadstone to improve the efficiency. This distance can then be subtracted from teh foam bumper cover to keep the overall depth the same.

2) Take pictures showing the differences between the couplers and pipes from CXRacing (ebay) and Intercooler Pipe Fabrication - Silicone Intake Systems Auto Parts There are what I consider significant differences with the couplers that could affect a build.

3) provide pictures on the, "i'm not a welder and don't have access to one", version of the vice grip hand held bead roller. I did a test run last night and it worked great. I need to make a minor change then will test again and post pictures.

The vortech V3-Si was ordered from Summit yesterday and is on backorder until 3/5! gives me time to finish the FMIC.

Just received the VMP tuning MAF housing. Quality piece of material there. Very pleased with that $99.

Ordered the parts needed to make a custom power pipe from silicone intakes. $112 including shipping.


SOLD : 02 Sonic Blue GT - Vortech V3-Si, Treadstone TRV25O, Tial Q, PMAS HPX MAF
SOLD : 14 Ruby Red F150 Ecoboost
15 Mustang GT PP - SCT Tune & Exhaust.
Click Here to see my 02 Vortech V3 Build Thread
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post #8 of 415 Old February 24th, 2012, 10:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 02sonicGT View Post
I am still up in the air about the fuel pump. There doesn't appear to be alot of history with the DivsionX stryker unit so I am a little hesitant. I did some searches on the Ford GT pump but am unsure if there is a particular year I should be looking for. RockAuto has them for $189 which isn't bad.

Some have mentioned overheating with the larger pumps and needing to run heavier gauge wire which also picks up a few % DC with the reduced load.
If you go with an SVT Focus or Ford GT pump you will more than likely need to add a KB BAP to it. There was a thread, I think it was here, where a guy just made 580rwhp with the new Walbro pump and KB 40amp BAP. There are a few on here running the Division X pump, but i'm not sure of their setups. I've seen a few posts of guys having problems with the pump, but didn't really read into it.

2004 DSG Mustang Mach 1 4r75w - 508/436 on E85. 460/396 on 93. Intercooled Vortech V1 S trim, Circle D 4c converter, BCA valve body, VRS o/r x pipe. 11.37 @ 120.8 mph 1.63 60'
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 02sonicGT View Post
Just received the VMP tuning MAF housing. Quality piece of material there. Very pleased with that $99.
I'm curious on why people spend the money on this housing instead of just having the flange welded to their piping. You can get the exact same flange that VMP Tuning sells for $45 + shipping off ebay or from lastcallracing.com for $30 shipped.

2004 DSG Mustang Mach 1 4r75w - 508/436 on E85. 460/396 on 93. Intercooled Vortech V1 S trim, Circle D 4c converter, BCA valve body, VRS o/r x pipe. 11.37 @ 120.8 mph 1.63 60'
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post #10 of 415 Old February 25th, 2012, 12:09 AM Thread Starter
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The first time I saw the hand made bead form tool was back in my import days with the Eclipse. Here is a link of one a guy made welding parts to his vice grips.

Homemade Intercooler pipe bead tool - DSM Forums

I don't have access to a welder nor felt like running someone down to charge me money so I used the same concept with a twist.

What you need:

1) Vice grips with curved bite
2) U-Clamp
3) 3" exhaust pipe clamp
4) braided wire that you hang pictures with

You bolt the u-clamp in the teeth of the vice grips...but if your tool is curved on the outside, as you tighten the clamp will just slip off the tip of the tool. This is where the wire comes in. I used the wire to pull the clamp back straight, this way as I tightened the nuts the clamp actually got tighter and the wire also got tighter as the clamp attempted to slide down but could not.

Here are the loose parts



And the assembled tool


Then you just place the bracket of the exhaust clamp along the edge of the pipe and bite down with the tool. Don't force the depth to quick or you will deform the IC pipe. Maybe a 1/16" deep each time around. Bite down, move over about 1/4" inch and bite down again. After the first pass tighten the wrench another 1/4 turn and make another pass. Keep going around until you are happy with the size of the bead.

Tool on a pipe



Raw end of a pipe



First pass around



Second pass around



SOLD : 02 Sonic Blue GT - Vortech V3-Si, Treadstone TRV25O, Tial Q, PMAS HPX MAF
SOLD : 14 Ruby Red F150 Ecoboost
15 Mustang GT PP - SCT Tune & Exhaust.
Click Here to see my 02 Vortech V3 Build Thread

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post #11 of 415 Old February 25th, 2012, 12:16 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blownstang View Post
I'm curious on why people spend the money on this housing instead of just having the flange welded to their piping. You can get the exact same flange that VMP Tuning sells for $45 + shipping off ebay or from lastcallracing.com for $30 shipped.
I don't know of anyone around my area that welds and have no idea what it would cost. I would imagine around $30 labor to do a decent job...puts you in the ballpark and the part will never look as clean as the VMP one. Granted it is a hundred bucks but it sweet looking and perfectly machined.


SOLD : 02 Sonic Blue GT - Vortech V3-Si, Treadstone TRV25O, Tial Q, PMAS HPX MAF
SOLD : 14 Ruby Red F150 Ecoboost
15 Mustang GT PP - SCT Tune & Exhaust.
Click Here to see my 02 Vortech V3 Build Thread
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post #12 of 415 Old February 25th, 2012, 12:18 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blownstang View Post
If you go with an SVT Focus or Ford GT pump you will more than likely need to add a KB BAP to it. There was a thread, I think it was here, where a guy just made 580rwhp with the new Walbro pump and KB 40amp BAP. There are a few on here running the Division X pump, but i'm not sure of their setups. I've seen a few posts of guys having problems with the pump, but didn't really read into it.
At the power levels I will be making I was really hoping on not having to use a BAP. I have 80k miles on the car so wanted to replace the pump anyway...and if I can get away from also having to by the BAP that would be nice. I'm thinking with a pump, wiring upgrade and 60lb injectors I should be ok.


SOLD : 02 Sonic Blue GT - Vortech V3-Si, Treadstone TRV25O, Tial Q, PMAS HPX MAF
SOLD : 14 Ruby Red F150 Ecoboost
15 Mustang GT PP - SCT Tune & Exhaust.
Click Here to see my 02 Vortech V3 Build Thread
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post #13 of 415 Old February 25th, 2012, 12:27 AM Thread Starter
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This next picture shows the difference between the 90 Degree coupler from Ebay (CXRacing) and SiliconeIntakes.com. The ebay unit is on the intercooler and is much smaller. Doesn't leave much room for slight deviations and I could almost feel the pipes wanting to pull out of it with little to no pressure.



This pic shows what I got done with the intake piping. The VMP pipe is a true 3" ID (inner diameter) pipe which is why the couplers are flexing a bit at the joints.



SOLD : 02 Sonic Blue GT - Vortech V3-Si, Treadstone TRV25O, Tial Q, PMAS HPX MAF
SOLD : 14 Ruby Red F150 Ecoboost
15 Mustang GT PP - SCT Tune & Exhaust.
Click Here to see my 02 Vortech V3 Build Thread

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post #14 of 415 Old February 25th, 2012, 01:46 AM
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Very nice man, Id rep but it wont let me.

And I completley agree, Silicone Intakes couplers are SO much better. A lot beefier, and longer, Makes it easier.

I have a long solid piece to go from the blower to the intercooler from Silicone intakes, but it doesnt have a bead welded on it, so Im going to try your idea out on it for sure.

14 Mustang GT M6 - TVS, Kooks Full Exhaust, AED Tune
11.04 @ 130.1
621/557 @ 8.6psi
Previous Cars
09 Corvette Z06 - 11.7 @ 123.5 (stock)
13 Mustang GT Bolt Ons - 11.58 @ 122.13
03 Mustang GT Vortech - 11.98 @ 118.68
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post #15 of 415 Old February 25th, 2012, 08:37 AM Thread Starter
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Thanks alot. FYI on the short side of the u-bolt. I thought it was going to be too long to fit inside the pipe and started cutting one off...realized I never actually checked I'll get around to cutting off the other end one of these days(it was a pain in the A$$). The u-bolt didn't have a tag on it just a bar code...I'll see if I can figure out what size it is. If you get one with too much girth the bead will be really wide. You want it to be about 1/2 or less the gap of the exhaust clamp saddle to give it room to mold the aluminum around it in the gap.

If the pictures or my explanation of it don't make sense let me know and I'll take some different ones.


SOLD : 02 Sonic Blue GT - Vortech V3-Si, Treadstone TRV25O, Tial Q, PMAS HPX MAF
SOLD : 14 Ruby Red F150 Ecoboost
15 Mustang GT PP - SCT Tune & Exhaust.
Click Here to see my 02 Vortech V3 Build Thread
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post #16 of 415 Old February 25th, 2012, 09:10 PM Thread Starter
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Made some more progress today with the intercooler. I bought a 2" x 1/8" x 8' long aluminum strip that I used to make brakets for the IC mounts.

The rest of it I cut up into 6" long strips. Then I stacked 5 of them on top of each other to make a 5/8" thick "shim" to put between the steel bumper and it's mounts. This created a 1" gap between the radiator and the intercooler which should keep Jivepepper happy

The thought is, by pulling the bumper out 5/8" I will shave 5/8" off the foam bumper cover to compensate so the overall depth does not change. This would not have been possible without shaving off the right ear on the left bumper mount as can be seen in earlier pictures. You can also compare these pictures to the earlier picture that shows the intercooler nearly right up against the radiator....not very effecient.

Pictures of what I am talking about:


Strips of aluminum



The new 1" gap.


Bumper sticks out just a bit more in the front (you can also see the little feet of my little helper)



But I will compensate by cutting some of the foam off..plenty to spare




Now that I have the intercooler mounted I can finish the piping from the IC to the intake. I got a little creative with a U shaped intercooler pipe and I am hopefull it will work out for me.

More to come!


SOLD : 02 Sonic Blue GT - Vortech V3-Si, Treadstone TRV25O, Tial Q, PMAS HPX MAF
SOLD : 14 Ruby Red F150 Ecoboost
15 Mustang GT PP - SCT Tune & Exhaust.
Click Here to see my 02 Vortech V3 Build Thread

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post #17 of 415 Old February 28th, 2012, 01:37 PM Thread Starter
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While waiting for Summit to get the V3 kit (on backorder until 3/12 now) I have been doing additional research on any restrictions to airflow. It seems to be a hot topic about the Air filter that comes with the Vortech kit (8H040-090).

The only specs I can find on it are that it has a 3.75" inlet and is 7" long.

Right now I have two options in mind that will have a 4" inlet to match the homemade powerpipe.

The first is from Treadstoneperformance at $31 and the second your standard K&N. Links to both:

The Treadstone has a 4" inlet is 8.8" long and 5.9" wide. Definately bigger and at a good price

Universal Hi-Flow Air Filters, Large- TREADSTONE PERFORMANCE

The K&N website has a huge selection in any shape or size but are obviously more pricey. The K&N I ran on my import was very efficient and I am tempted to run it again.

The one I am looking at has a 4" inlet, is 9" long and 7" wide. Massive in comparison to the Vortech. I found it on Amazon for $43 which isn't that much more.

K&N RD-1460 - Universal Air Filters, Universal Air Filter

I need to mock up a cardboard unit to see if it will cram in the fenderwell with all the FMIC piping. Gradeschool skills here we come.


SOLD : 02 Sonic Blue GT - Vortech V3-Si, Treadstone TRV25O, Tial Q, PMAS HPX MAF
SOLD : 14 Ruby Red F150 Ecoboost
15 Mustang GT PP - SCT Tune & Exhaust.
Click Here to see my 02 Vortech V3 Build Thread
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post #18 of 415 Old March 1st, 2012, 10:16 PM Thread Starter
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As much as i wanted the extra large k&n filter to fit, i just could not come up with an angle along with the ic pipes that it would fit. Thank god i mocked it up before buying it. I am going with the treadstone filter. Received the piping for my homemade power pipe from silicone intakes. Quality stuff once again. The extra long couplers are quite nice.

Cutting the foam bumper this weekend and buttoning it back up so i can burn off some gas to get to a quarter tank. Need to tackle the fuel pump.


SOLD : 02 Sonic Blue GT - Vortech V3-Si, Treadstone TRV25O, Tial Q, PMAS HPX MAF
SOLD : 14 Ruby Red F150 Ecoboost
15 Mustang GT PP - SCT Tune & Exhaust.
Click Here to see my 02 Vortech V3 Build Thread

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post #19 of 415 Old March 1st, 2012, 10:58 PM
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I went with a big K&N with the 4" x 9 - went cone shaped - it fit fine for me



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post #20 of 415 Old March 2nd, 2012, 10:07 AM Thread Starter
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I was aiming for the cylinder shape and it was 7 inches in diameter. The length was no problem it was the girth of the dam thing. It was going to rub badly on metal work that I didn't want to trim. The treadstone is 5.88" in diameter at 8.88" in length. I have room for 6" diameter so it was a good fit.

Do you have pictures of how yours tucks up in the fender?


SOLD : 02 Sonic Blue GT - Vortech V3-Si, Treadstone TRV25O, Tial Q, PMAS HPX MAF
SOLD : 14 Ruby Red F150 Ecoboost
15 Mustang GT PP - SCT Tune & Exhaust.
Click Here to see my 02 Vortech V3 Build Thread
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Project 02SonicGT Vortech V3 with Treadstone TRV25 - Trick Tuners Forums This thread Refback March 29th, 2012 03:16 PM
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