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post #41 of 110 Old November 15th, 2015, 02:35 AM
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post #42 of 110 Old November 15th, 2015, 08:27 AM
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Good new guys, Obama is going to "commit 50 troops to Syria"

Problem solved.

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post #43 of 110 Old November 15th, 2015, 09:48 AM
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Good new guys, Obama is going to "commit 50 troops to Syria"

Problem solved.
Yeah, but somehow that will cost $250 billion dollars.

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post #44 of 110 Old November 15th, 2015, 10:02 AM
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Honestly if some of these nations set there differences aside with vladimir putin, they could easily end this shit in Syria.

But what would the long term effect of that relationship entail to?




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post #45 of 110 Old November 15th, 2015, 11:45 AM
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post #46 of 110 Old November 15th, 2015, 03:09 PM
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Honestly if some of these nations set there differences aside with vladimir putin, they could easily end this shit in Syria.
I'm afraid the radical Islam problem is not resolvable without an outright war on Islam - yes, I said it. I know we've worked very hard to put political separation between the peaceful Islamic faith and radical Muslim militants - but the crazy ones are simply too integrated into the larger Muslim culture. Fighting "just the bad ones" is like trying to pick olive slices out of deep dish pizza. Sure, you can get the obvious ones on top - but there are so many others melted down in there and mixed-in, you have no hope of getting them all.

Ultimately, we either have to accept terrorism as a consequence of religious tolerance (and just live with it/deal with it) - or we have to kill enough Muslims so that the broader culture loses their will to fight the West. I hate to say this, but nothing short of a campaign of absolute genocide will stop this. We're not going to "westernize" these nations with our hearts-and-minds strategies. I hate to be so cold, but until we're really ready to kill them indiscriminately, the game of geo-political whack-a-mole will continue.

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post #47 of 110 Old November 15th, 2015, 04:31 PM
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I'm afraid the radical Islam problem is not resolvable without an outright war on Islam - yes, I said it. I know we've worked very hard to put political separation between the peaceful Islamic faith and radical Muslim militants - but the crazy ones are simply too integrated into the larger Muslim culture. Fighting "just the bad ones" is like trying to pick olive slices out of deep dish pizza. Sure, you can get the obvious ones on top - but there are so many others melted down in there and mixed-in, you have no hope of getting them all.

Ultimately, we either have to accept terrorism as a consequence of religious tolerance (and just live with it/deal with it) - or we have to kill enough Muslims so that the broader culture loses their will to fight the West. I hate to say this, but nothing short of a campaign of absolute genocide will stop this. We're not going to "westernize" these nations with our hearts-and-minds strategies. I hate to be so cold, but until we're really ready to kill them indiscriminately, the game of geo-political whack-a-mole will continue.
I agree to an extent, but put yourself in the shoes of a Muslim. Imagine a country (USA) killing people just because of their religion. You would look at America the same way we look at ISIS. We wouldn't be any different than ISIS if we just slaughtered Muslims.

It's very important that we attack them hard and fast, but with precision. Yes there will be some mistakes and innocent people will die, that's part of war, but it will be for the good of the world.

If we did take the approach you described, it would only make it easier for people to turn against America and make the problem even bigger.

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post #48 of 110 Old November 15th, 2015, 05:59 PM
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I agree to an extent, but put yourself in the shoes of a Muslim. Imagine a country (USA) killing people just because of their religion. You would look at America the same way we look at ISIS. We wouldn't be any different than ISIS if we just slaughtered Muslims.

It's very important that we attack them hard and fast, but with precision. Yes there will be some mistakes and innocent people will die, that's part of war, but it will be for the good of the world.

If we did take the approach you described, it would only make it easier for people to turn against America and make the problem even bigger.
Yeah! I'm not suggesting we ACTUALLY DO that, I just saying that's what it may take (to win this war). They're not so dissimilar to the Japanese combatants in WWII (though admittedly an entirely different logistical situation). The suicide missions and die-to-the-last-man battlefield ideologies made Japanese forces extraordinarily difficult to defeat. Many of the strategists believed a Japanese homeland invasion would have cost a million men. Without the threat of complete annihilation from atomic bombs, Japan may have fought to the edge of their own cultural destruction. I think the Jihadists are, in at least some ways, similar.

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post #49 of 110 Old November 16th, 2015, 11:20 AM
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Originally Posted by Mike in Kentucky View Post
I'm afraid the radical Islam problem is not resolvable without an outright war on Islam - yes, I said it. I know we've worked very hard to put political separation between the peaceful Islamic faith and radical Muslim militants - but the crazy ones are simply too integrated into the larger Muslim culture. Fighting "just the bad ones" is like trying to pick olive slices out of deep dish pizza. Sure, you can get the obvious ones on top - but there are so many others melted down in there and mixed-in, you have no hope of getting them all.

Ultimately, we either have to accept terrorism as a consequence of religious tolerance (and just live with it/deal with it) - or we have to kill enough Muslims so that the broader culture loses their will to fight the West. I hate to say this, but nothing short of a campaign of absolute genocide will stop this. We're not going to "westernize" these nations with our hearts-and-minds strategies. I hate to be so cold, but until we're really ready to kill them indiscriminately, the game of geo-political whack-a-mole will continue.
Interesting personal thoughts Mike.

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post #50 of 110 Old November 16th, 2015, 11:48 AM
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post #51 of 110 Old November 16th, 2015, 12:45 PM
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Isis is allowed to grow because nobody fights back in the countries they are in. People being led in lines to have their heads cut off, people allowing themselves to be tied up, put in a ditch by the hundreds and having their heads blown off without putting up a fight is unbelievable. Where is the will to survive?

There is zero reason the US and other countries can't destroy Isis with minimal collateral damage. If some innocent people die that is the cost of keeping the entire world free of Isis.

Compared to our military these Isis might as well be using slingshots. We need to drop RoE and let our military work.
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post #52 of 110 Old November 16th, 2015, 12:55 PM
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I have distant family members that are Muslim have served with quite a few of them and this topic has come up before. So do I beleive we should have some sort of genocide when it comes to them a just hey lets kill them all at will campaign. No I don't and there is no need for me to even go even further on explaining why or why not. Trust me when I say I have heard that talk plenty of times I just never thought that way though not even after this or that or from a recovery bed.

To each is own though not gonna say I don't see why you said that bc quite a few ppl have said it before. Nothing further on that bc I don't wanna go to personal on it with examples and situations bc it may be viewed a certain way. But nah not on board with a genocide of Muslims. And a solution to the problem seems to be far from simple where Joe Schmoe can lay out in a paragraph or few or with a short plan.

One could only wish it were that simple. Lets just think about how long some of these ppl have been fighting. The names just have been changing with some over the years and decades. You can kill the person but what about the mindset that has spread to the next 3 ppl and so on and so on. It's sort of like some of the social issues issues here at home the ppl pass away but the mindset they had is passed along to others and spread and half the time you don't know to who until it surfaces in it's own way. Even when fighting them it's difficult to fight them bc they blend right in and you can't just kill everyone. You don't know who is who until you are in the shit with them or they blow themselves up. So the frustrations are clearly understood but shit sometimes It's easier said than done. Maybe these guys are not as pussy as the other guys and will stay identifiable in uniform the entire time. I think it's doubtful. I think they will stay in uniform for the cameras but when and if it comes engagement time they will blend bc they are they same damn guys just a new name and more recruits. Starting to ramble on outta here.

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post #53 of 110 Old November 16th, 2015, 01:07 PM
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I am open and accepting to any non violent human no matter the religion. Any human who practices AND supports a religion calling for the termination of innocent people should be destroyed. If Muslims want to live in peace with Christians, atheists, Jews, I'm all for it. I could personally care less how they worship. Once they try to kill people they die.

Unfortunately Mike may be right. I think the key is population control of Isis. Keep killing them, keep them scared, keep them small. It's like mice or ants. You will never wipe them out but we can keep them out of our house and when we see one we strike without mercy.
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post #54 of 110 Old November 16th, 2015, 01:13 PM
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I have distant family members that are Muslim have served with quite a few of them and this topic has come up before. So do I beleive we should have some sort of genocide when it comes to them a just hey lets kill them all at will campaign. No I don't and there is no need for me to even go even further on explaining why or why not. Trust me when I say I have heard that talk plenty of times I just never thought that way though not even after this or that or from a recovery bed.

To each is own though not gonna say I don't see why you said that bc quite a few ppl have said it before. Nothing further on that bc I don't wanna go to personal on it with examples and situations bc it may be viewed a certain way. But nah not on board with a genocide of Muslims. And a solution to the problem seems to be far from simple where Joe Schmoe can lay out in a paragraph or few or with a short plan.

One could only wish it were that simple. Lets just think about how long some of these ppl have been fighting. The names just have been changing with some over the years and decades. You can kill the person but what about the mindset that has spread to the next 3 ppl and so on and so on. It's sort of like some of the social issues issues here at home the ppl pass away but the mindset they had is passed along to others and spread and half the time you don't know to who until it surfaces in it's own way.
I also have multiple muslim friends who I would gladly defend over some ignorant rednecks.
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post #55 of 110 Old November 16th, 2015, 01:26 PM
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I also have multiple muslim friends who I would gladly defend over some ignorant rednecks.
I feel you man. I understand that things get very weird whenever something happens or whenever this topic comes up. I just never had it in my mind in the places that we were in that " okay we are at war with Islam and are here to kill the Muslims". If that's the case every mission would have been a drive around and shoot at will mission. I can't wrap my head and thoughts around something like that I guess some ppl can. To each is own I guess. Idk what else to say about it all.

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post #56 of 110 Old November 16th, 2015, 01:33 PM
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I feel you man. I understand that things get very weird whenever something happens or whenever this topic comes up. I just never had it in my mind in the places that we were in that " okay we are at war with Islam and are here to kill the Muslims". If that's the case every mission would have been a drive around and shoot at will mission. I can't wrap my head and thoughts around something like that I guess some ppl can. To each is own I guess. Idk what else to say about it all.
I dont think that is going to happen, although it might. I knew a guy that used to work with me that was one of the first deployed to Iraq after 9/11. He told me he had to go house by house, knock down the door, throw a stun grenade, and shoot everybody inside. Then move on to the next house. You will never hear about that in the news.


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post #57 of 110 Old November 16th, 2015, 01:34 PM
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I feel you man. I understand that things get very weird whenever something happens or whenever this topic comes up. I just never had it in my mind in the places that we were in that " okay we are at war with Islam and are here to kill the Muslims". If that's the case every mission would have been a drive around and shoot at will mission. I can't wrap my head and thoughts around something like that I guess some ppl can. To each is own I guess. Idk what else to say about it all.
And I feel that says a lot coming from someone who has actually spent time in the shit in that part of the world.

I can't claim that as I know I don't have the fortitude to be military and I'm not going to try to act otherwise.

I have no problem talking to my Muslim friends about these sort of incidents. They have no affiliation with these fucking assholes. Imagine how they feel: "fuck, here we go again. We finally make some progress in not being profiled every second of our existence and these fuckers put us back to square one. Guess I won't leave my house for the next couple weeks."

These are U.S. citizens fully integrated and accepting of American culture and minding their own business. But yeah, we should just tell them to get the fuck out and go deal with "their" problem in the Middle East. People need to gain some actual perspective.

Hell, people have actively sought out Sheikhs and assaulted them because they're too fucking stupid to realize that not all brown people are Muslim. "But they wear that funny towel hat thing so they've got to be da muzzlaamms!"
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post #58 of 110 Old November 16th, 2015, 02:28 PM
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I dont think that is going to happen, although it might. I knew a guy that used to work with me that was one of the first deployed to Iraq after 9/11. He told me he had to go house by house, knock down the door, throw a stun grenade, and shoot everybody inside. Then move on to the next house. You will never hear about that in the news.
Early 2003 is when Iraq was invaded bc before that there was a different deployment right after 9/11. But I deployed to go to Iraq mid April. First got to Kuwait then crossed the boarder into Iraq after the 20th. To be honest with you things were alot different during that invasion than what you hear now but it was the start of the war. The things you would see, hear, smell etc... Imo has no place in the news I wouldn't want my family or friends to see it bc quite a bit of it is somewhat damaging depending on the person. I don't wanna say too much about the experiences really but things started to change even within a 5 months bc some ppl were just out of control.

By the next time late 2004 deployment and convoys seems reeled in. Paperwork for everything including statements when you discharged a round. Don't wanna go on and on about it bc I try to avoid talking about that stuff on here now but Iraq in early 03 was kinda different imo and I don't feel that stuff should be on the news. I know I got a verbal gag order before I left.

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post #59 of 110 Old November 16th, 2015, 02:31 PM
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The rednecks are the ones who are going to be prepared when Isis comes to their hometown.
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post #60 of 110 Old November 16th, 2015, 02:35 PM
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And I feel that says a lot coming from someone who has actually spent time in the shit in that part of the world.

I can't claim that as I know I don't have the fortitude to be military and I'm not going to try to act otherwise.

I have no problem talking to my Muslim friends about these sort of incidents. They have no affiliation with these fucking assholes. Imagine how they feel: "fuck, here we go again. We finally make some progress in not being profiled every second of our existence and these fuckers put us back to square one. Guess I won't leave my house for the next couple weeks."

These are U.S. citizens fully integrated and accepting of American culture and minding their own business. But yeah, we should just tell them to get the fuck out and go deal with "their" problem in the Middle East. People need to gain some actual perspective.

Hell, people have actively sought out Sheikhs and assaulted them because they're too fucking stupid to realize that not all brown people are Muslim. "But they wear that funny towel hat thing so they've got to be da muzzlaamms!"
It's crazy and sad imo how ppl put them all under one cloud man. I think in a way it can be fear and hate based person depending bc some ppl throw some serious flames and see them all as one and imo that's just sad but not surprising to see. Bc you never know how some may react or lash out when constant fear is thrown out or mongered up.

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