Lack of transparency and 'stupidity of the American voter essential to get ACA passed - Page 3 - Forums at Modded Mustangs
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #41 of 77 Old November 16th, 2014, 01:23 PM Thread Starter
7.62x39 CO2 Cannon
 
JohnC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: USA
Posts: 5,018
           
iTrader: 1 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by Novanutcase View Post
Right....the young and healthy NEVER EVER have catastrophic injuries so when it does happen WE should pay for it. Good idea.

Why do you keep arguing this as if the ACA keeps the taxpayers from picking up the tab?

John/Nova, if you're serious, you realize the ACA forces us to pay for the uninsured. There is absolutely no way the ACA keeps the tax payers from "picking up the tab".

A part of how we pay for it is through the insurance subsidies, taxes subsidies, and the penalty/fines paid directly to the IRS for those who choose not to buy HCI. And that's not all of it.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Novanutcase View Post
I'm not talking about the ACA in particular, more so, I'm referring to the smear campaign the right is moving on by making, once again, exaggerated claims that Gruber is the architect of the law when he was, at best, a small player in the scheme of things.

So he played such a small role in the ACA, that he is running around in academia. etc., talking about how they designed this and lied to the American voters, etc., to get this HC law passed and he made nearly $400,000.00 for doing it, but he is a small player and just mentioning what he said makes for exaggerated claims? John/Nova, he had plenty to do with the ACA. He consulted and did everything he could to help and he is now bragging about it, calling the voters (you included) who bought it hook, line and sinker, stupid and uninformed.

In a news conference earlier this week, House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi tried to say Gruber had no significant role in crafting Obamacare, adding she doesn't even "know who he is." Almost immediately it was pointed out her office had cited Gruber's work in the past in relation to the CBO report.

Despite some resistance to the term “architect,” Gruber joined the president’s transition team in 2008 and no one disputes he played a key role in the law’s creation. The Washington Post reports he was also paid "almost $400,000" for the work, controversial in its own right.

Gruber has made controversial comments in the past, but they don’t compare to the comments that came to light this week, six videos in total and counting – including one where he refers to the “stupidity of the American voter.” In another, when talking about Obamacare tax credits, he said, “American voters are too stupid to understand the difference.”

“If you have a law that makes explicit that healthy people pay in and sick people get money, it wouldn’t have passed,” Gruber said in a video from 2013. “Lack of transparency is a huge political advantage and, basically, call it the stupidity of the American voter or whatever. But basically that was really critical to getting the thing to pass.”

In yet another from 2012, Gruber said in a speech at the University of Rhode Island: “It’s a very clever, you know, basic exploitation of the lack of economic understanding of the American voter.”

A fifth video was revealed today where he seems to be teasing a Vermont man concerned with possible unintended consequences of the Affordable Care Act. After listening to the man’s concerns, Gruber responds, “Was this written by my adolescent children by any chance?”

They don't even dispute it, but you do.

The White House spokesman "denounced him" and Gruber apologizes saying he spoke off the cuff.

But yes, keep on defending these left-wing collectivist arrogant douche-bags.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Novanutcase View Post
Yet it hasn't and Massachusetts health care is probably one of the best in the country along with an overwhelming approval by it's constituency. On it's initial rollout it had all the same issues that Obamacare is now having yet it didn't have an entire political party and grievance industry rooting for it's failure.

Massachusetts health care doesn't effect me at all. They can do what they want. If it works at the state level, maybe the math works since they have less sick and uninsured and enough folks to pay in to the system to cover, I don't know. But it is a states rights issue and they are within their power to have state HC like Romneycare.

But the Federal govt has no authority to force me to buy a HCI policy or fine me if I don't. They far overstepped their bounds. We all know what a sham the SCOTUS ruling was, but since you're for it, you're happy with it no matter how shitty it is. You're just keeping hope it'll be fixed in to something else better. I take issue with that, along with a plethora of other things.

This is a colossal fucked up scandal and if it would have been anyone buy left-wing Democrats that did this, there would be an all out media crusade for justice for the American people who were lied to and manipulated by false information and the deliberate lack of honest transparency, yet you hardly hear anything other than the defenders of the left in the media trying to cover it.

Even you sit here and gobble it up and take the left's talking points and defend it in all your spare time.

2010 CGM Camaro 2SS RS 6L90
Stage II ProCharger D1X
760rwhp @ 14 PSI


Last edited by JohnC; November 16th, 2014 at 02:52 PM.
JohnC is online now  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #42 of 77 Old November 16th, 2014, 08:50 PM Thread Starter
7.62x39 CO2 Cannon
 
JohnC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: USA
Posts: 5,018
           
iTrader: 1 reviews


Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Grubering_Comic.jpg
Views:	52
Size:	68.2 KB
ID:	127794  

2010 CGM Camaro 2SS RS 6L90
Stage II ProCharger D1X
760rwhp @ 14 PSI

JohnC is online now  
post #43 of 77 Old November 16th, 2014, 08:55 PM Thread Starter
7.62x39 CO2 Cannon
 
JohnC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: USA
Posts: 5,018
           
iTrader: 1 reviews
Listen to this to the end. This is how they lie and manipulate folks...


2010 CGM Camaro 2SS RS 6L90
Stage II ProCharger D1X
760rwhp @ 14 PSI

JohnC is online now  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #44 of 77 Old November 17th, 2014, 11:04 AM Thread Starter
7.62x39 CO2 Cannon
 
JohnC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: USA
Posts: 5,018
           
iTrader: 1 reviews
More tapes surface of Obamacare architect calling Americans stupid | Rare

---------- Post added at 12:04 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:54 AM ----------

‘I was DUMBSTRUCK!’ – CBS’ Bob Schieffer on Gruber’s Obamacare comments


Read more: ‘I was DUMBSTRUCK!’ – CBS’ Bob Schieffer on Gruber’s Obamacare comments » The Right Scoop -

2010 CGM Camaro 2SS RS 6L90
Stage II ProCharger D1X
760rwhp @ 14 PSI

JohnC is online now  
post #45 of 77 Old November 17th, 2014, 02:11 PM
MM's Caller of Bullshit
 
Destination S197's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Baton Rouge, LA
Posts: 7,909
                     
Garage
iTrader: 1 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by Novanutcase View Post
Tell that to people with pre-existing conditions. Tell that to families that have gone bankrupt because the good folks at the insurance company decided they didn't want to continue paying for Lil' Jimmies cancer treatments. Tell that to the taxpayers that have to pay for irresponsible people who use the emergency room as their "doctor visit" but have no insurance because they wanted to spend that money on "other areas of life".

John
As someone who was denied insurance coverage when I was 23 because a doctor I had when I was 14 diagnosed me with discoid lupus. Fuck the pre-existing condition crap. They denied me insurance coverage despite the fact that I had a written letter from my current GP that I did NOT have lupus and had the blood work to prove it.

I'm glad people can get covered now so the ACA can stay IMO.

On top of that, I was sick earlier in the year and had to have blood tests run to check for auto-immune, the bill I got was $2500 and because I had insurance through work, it was only $500 out of pocket. So yes, some young people can manage to make it through life without forking out money like JohnC has but for a lot of people, even young ones without well paying jobs get stuck with shit medical bills. Four years ago I had a severe pain in my abdomen that nearly kept me from being able to walk. I had to be helped into the ER. The three day stay in the hospital and a cat scan later was $8000. A bill I only had to cover $800 of because of insurance. I was 25 then and had just gotten out of college. That bill would have ruined me if I was out on my own at that point.

People that weren't quite as lucky as me deserve to be covered by this stuff. It's better for society if we're all healthy and not broken because of lacking health coverage.

If anyone wanted an example of what can happen even to young people, there you go. I'm glad people are being covered by ACA even if it costs me a little more in taxes.
Destination S197 is offline  
post #46 of 77 Old November 17th, 2014, 03:16 PM
I Post Entirely Way Too Much
 
T-Lee. 30's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Alabama
Posts: 11,147
                 
iTrader: 0 reviews
Send a message via Yahoo to T-Lee. 30
^ I don't go to the hospital or clinics too often myself that's not saying that I have not been in the past couple of years for care. But for my family the wife and three kids they have been quite often for some somewhat minor things up to some procedures being done. Tricare sends the paperwork in to the house for anything not done on post and it shows what the cost was and what they payed and the minor charged to me and I know if I didn't have healthcare that those bills could start adding up.

It just makes me wonder in the past how those with various pay situations dealt with certain situation when it came to health issues if they didn't have healthcare. For one who is very well of and has a substantial savings or backup plan it would be no issue but for others any issue that may arise or shall I say if life happens it may put them in a financial bind.

-03 GT V1S trim 5psi, 3xxhp/3xxtq
-06 TBSS LS3H,cam,f.exhaust 4xxrwhp/4xxrwtq
-03 Dakota SLT Quad cab 2wd stock

Iraq and Afghanistan War Vet . Convoys and convoy security. My Wife is also a Army and Afghanistan war vet.
T-Lee. 30 is offline  
post #47 of 77 Old November 17th, 2014, 05:34 PM
I Post Entirely Way Too Much
 
T-Lee. 30's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Alabama
Posts: 11,147
                 
iTrader: 0 reviews
Send a message via Yahoo to T-Lee. 30
Enrollment Day One: 100,000 applications ? Obama pushes enrollment ? GOP preps ACA attack plan - POLITICO Pulse - POLITICO.com

-03 GT V1S trim 5psi, 3xxhp/3xxtq
-06 TBSS LS3H,cam,f.exhaust 4xxrwhp/4xxrwtq
-03 Dakota SLT Quad cab 2wd stock

Iraq and Afghanistan War Vet . Convoys and convoy security. My Wife is also a Army and Afghanistan war vet.
T-Lee. 30 is offline  
post #48 of 77 Old November 17th, 2014, 06:26 PM Thread Starter
7.62x39 CO2 Cannon
 
JohnC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: USA
Posts: 5,018
           
iTrader: 1 reviews
Lack of transparency and 'stupidity of the American voter essential to get AC...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Destination S197 View Post
As someone who was denied insurance coverage when I was 23 because a doctor I had when I was 14 diagnosed me with discoid lupus. Fuck the pre-existing condition crap. They denied me insurance coverage despite the fact that I had a written letter from my current GP that I did NOT have lupus and had the blood work to prove it.

I'm glad people can get covered now so the ACA can stay IMO.

On top of that, I was sick earlier in the year and had to have blood tests run to check for auto-immune, the bill I got was $2500 and because I had insurance through work, it was only $500 out of pocket. So yes, some young people can manage to make it through life without forking out money like JohnC has but for a lot of people, even young ones without well paying jobs get stuck with shit medical bills. Four years ago I had a severe pain in my abdomen that nearly kept me from being able to walk. I had to be helped into the ER. The three day stay in the hospital and a cat scan later was $8000. A bill I only had to cover $800 of because of insurance. I was 25 then and had just gotten out of college. That bill would have ruined me if I was out on my own at that point.

People that weren't quite as lucky as me deserve to be covered by this stuff. It's better for society if we're all healthy and not broken because of lacking health coverage.

If anyone wanted an example of what can happen even to young people, there you go. I'm glad people are being covered by ACA even if it costs me a little more in taxes.

Well, they could have passed a law so that folks with pre existing conditions couldn't be denied coverage without all the other BS and forcing me by law in to the system or I pay a fine and even after paying the fine, I don't get coverage. They use the fine to cover others.

How is fucking folks like me OK but passing a more sensible law like I mentioned not an option?

2010 CGM Camaro 2SS RS 6L90
Stage II ProCharger D1X
760rwhp @ 14 PSI


Last edited by JohnC; November 18th, 2014 at 03:37 AM.
JohnC is online now  
post #49 of 77 Old November 18th, 2014, 09:26 PM
MM Fanatic
 
Woodman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Duluth, MN
Posts: 4,562
               
iTrader: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnC View Post
Well, they could have passed a law so that folks with pre existing conditions couldn't be denied coverage without all the other BS and forcing me by law in to the system or I pay a fine and even after paying the fine, I don't get coverage. They use the fine to cover others.

How is fucking folks like me OK but passing a more sensible law like I mentioned not an option?
Because everyone wants to feel good that the law was passed, and choose to ignore all the bad about the law until it finally hits them in the pocket. Once it does, you can bet they're going to cry foul.

Or, maybe they can continue to "feel good" about the law until quality of care takes a nose dive.

Remember, our health care system is so highly regarded people risked coming here with EBOLA to get treatment.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BWAL View Post
woodman: achieving the impossible since 1967. 1973? 1980? 1985? 1976? whatever, you get my point
Quote:
Originally Posted by BWAL View Post
ford's advertising slogan was literally "you can pay for all of it today or you can go fuck yourself"
Woodman is offline  
post #50 of 77 Old November 18th, 2014, 10:15 PM Thread Starter
7.62x39 CO2 Cannon
 
JohnC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: USA
Posts: 5,018
           
iTrader: 1 reviews
Rand Paul weighed in on this.... Thinks he should have to return his pay.

See the videos

EXCLUSIVE VIDEO: 'Hannity' Confronts Jonathan Gruber at MIT | Fox News Insider

2010 CGM Camaro 2SS RS 6L90
Stage II ProCharger D1X
760rwhp @ 14 PSI

JohnC is online now  
post #51 of 77 Old November 18th, 2014, 10:26 PM
I Post Entirely Way Too Much
 
Novanutcase's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Los Angeles, California
Posts: 6,054
               
iTrader: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by Destination S197 View Post
As someone who was denied insurance coverage when I was 23 because a doctor I had when I was 14 diagnosed me with discoid lupus. Fuck the pre-existing condition crap. They denied me insurance coverage despite the fact that I had a written letter from my current GP that I did NOT have lupus and had the blood work to prove it.

I'm glad people can get covered now so the ACA can stay IMO.

On top of that, I was sick earlier in the year and had to have blood tests run to check for auto-immune, the bill I got was $2500 and because I had insurance through work, it was only $500 out of pocket. So yes, some young people can manage to make it through life without forking out money like JohnC has but for a lot of people, even young ones without well paying jobs get stuck with shit medical bills. Four years ago I had a severe pain in my abdomen that nearly kept me from being able to walk. I had to be helped into the ER. The three day stay in the hospital and a cat scan later was $8000. A bill I only had to cover $800 of because of insurance. I was 25 then and had just gotten out of college. That bill would have ruined me if I was out on my own at that point.

People that weren't quite as lucky as me deserve to be covered by this stuff. It's better for society if we're all healthy and not broken because of lacking health coverage.

If anyone wanted an example of what can happen even to young people, there you go. I'm glad people are being covered by ACA even if it costs me a little more in taxes.
Thank you. This whole 'But I made it through without insurance" may be fine for some but there are many others that were affected and the ACA is a godsend for them but, hey, fuck them right?

The CBO reports that are claiming that the ACA will actually SAVE us money in the long run never seems to come up in the conversation and if it does the typical response is "Oh but they're a government agency so the report MUST be a lie!" yet when something from the CBO that supports whatever claim they may be making at the time? Then the CBO is very qualified at what they do.

John

SOLD - '03 GT, Max Moto Max Grip Box, Wilwood SL 6 front/DL4 rear Big Brake Kit, Corbeau Seats, MGW Short Shifter, MAC Long Tube Headers/Prochamber mid/ Flowmaster 40, FRPP 4.10, TrickFlow Diff Cover/75mm TB/Plenum, Eaton Posi, Moser 31 spl Axles
Novanutcase is offline  
post #52 of 77 Old November 18th, 2014, 11:08 PM Thread Starter
7.62x39 CO2 Cannon
 
JohnC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: USA
Posts: 5,018
           
iTrader: 1 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by Novanutcase View Post
Thank you. This whole 'But I made it through without insurance" may be fine for some but there are many others that were affected and the ACA is a godsend for them but, hey, fuck them right?

John
So it is OK to fuck others? Fuck you, pay my bills no matter what a strain it puts on others finances? You obviously don't care about the struggles of other folks and how these increased taxes and fines, increased costs of HCI policies, and those who lost their plans for worse ones, etc., will affect their bottle line.

If it was all about pre-existing conditions getting covered, they could have made a single law to fix that. No one get's denied care, I already showed you the law. There are a lot of Govt and charity programs that help the poor already if they can't afford medical bills. So I really feel the rest of the ACA is just a colossal mess and it is not going to work, especially in the way it was sold to you.

---------- Post added at 12:08 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:05 AM ----------

We said Obamacare was a crony capitalist jack for the insurance companies, Now even the New York Times agrees with us

It’s about time, but it’s too late now. I guess there is some comfort in knowing that the even the statist Gray Lady sees what Obamcare actually is. Though I am going to guess that the New York Times editorial board isn’t going to come out for repeal even though the program was sold with out and out lies and is pouring billions in taxpayer dollars into the pockets of the health insurance companies.


(From The New York Times)

But since the Affordable Care Act was enacted in 2010, the relationship between the Obama administration and insurers has evolved into a powerful, mutually beneficial partnership that has been a boon to the nation’s largest private health plans and led to a profitable surge in their Medicaid enrollment.

The insurers in turn have provided crucial support to Mr. Obama in court battles over the health care law, including a case now before the Supreme Court challenging the federal subsidies paid to insurance companies on behalf of low- and moderate-income consumers. Last fall, a unit of one of the nation’s largest insurers, UnitedHealth Group, helped the administration repair the HealthCare.gov website after it crashed in the opening days of enrollment…

…“These companies all look at government programs as growth markets,” said Michael J. Tuffin, a former executive vice president of America’s Health Insurance Plans, the main lobby for the industry. “There will be nearly $2 trillion of subsidized coverage through insurance exchanges and Medicaid over the next 10 years. These are pragmatic companies. They will follow the customer.”

The relationship is expected only to deepen as the two sides grow more intertwined.
This is why the only real way to fight crony capitalism is to reduce the thing which enables the cronies – intrusive government. You can’t regulate cronies away. Cronies LOVE regulation. It’s how they make their bones. No regulation, no need for crony deals. Less regulation, fewer crony deals. That’s the way it goes.

But this is a hard concept for many of our friends on the “Left” to accept. It means really questioning the welfare state as we have known it. Could it be that all that big government wasn’t what it was sold as, what I was taught it was? That is a hard bridge to cross. But give it a shot my liberal friends, the future of our fine country may depend on it.

We said Obamacare was a crony capitalist jack for the insurance companies, Now even the New York Times agrees with us | AgainstCronyCapitalism.org

2010 CGM Camaro 2SS RS 6L90
Stage II ProCharger D1X
760rwhp @ 14 PSI

JohnC is online now  
post #53 of 77 Old November 19th, 2014, 01:55 AM
I Post Entirely Way Too Much
 
Novanutcase's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Los Angeles, California
Posts: 6,054
               
iTrader: 0 reviews
At this point anything I say will fall on deaf ears, besides I'm tired of repeating myself only to get the same crap I read from you so I guess at this point all I can say is we will see how it plays out. Now that you have the majority in congress you need for full repeal I guess we'll see where that goes too.

John

SOLD - '03 GT, Max Moto Max Grip Box, Wilwood SL 6 front/DL4 rear Big Brake Kit, Corbeau Seats, MGW Short Shifter, MAC Long Tube Headers/Prochamber mid/ Flowmaster 40, FRPP 4.10, TrickFlow Diff Cover/75mm TB/Plenum, Eaton Posi, Moser 31 spl Axles
Novanutcase is offline  
post #54 of 77 Old November 19th, 2014, 02:05 AM
Pawsitively sexy
 
Sixpointslow's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Lower Sussex, DE
Posts: 10,561
                   
iTrader: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by Novanutcase View Post
At this point anything I say will fall on deaf ears, besides I'm tired of repeating myself only to get the same crap I read from you so I guess at this point all I can say is we will see how it plays out. Now that you have the majority in congress you need for full repeal I guess we'll see where that goes too.

John
This has got to be one of the most talked about issues on here. Nothing is going to change anyone's mind. He won't even accept defeat on death panels.

2012 CTS-V

Not stock


Sixpointslow is offline  
post #55 of 77 Old November 19th, 2014, 03:30 AM
He of Long Wind
 
Mike in Kentucky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Oil Springs, KY
Posts: 2,142
           
iTrader: 0 reviews
There are only two rules in politics:

1) Get Elected
2) Get Re-Elected

This has nothing to do with what is good or bad for America (or the health of Americans for that matter). This is about votes - it always has been. Dems have done a masterful job of dividing society into fallaciously marginalized sub-groups (based on gender, race, age, income, region, sexual orientation, education level, etc).

Each sub-group is methodically pulled aside to receive their prepackaged propaganda, convincing them that THEIR group is being oppressed by the national villain. Once that group is properly agitated, Dems simply point the finger at the same old bad guys ... MIDDLE- AND UPPER-INCOME STRAIGHT WHITE CHRISTIAN MEN. Every other slice of society is fair game for divisive liberal propaganda. Divide and conquer. It's a simple yet highly effective political strategy. We can't deny that it works. Sadly, most people don't really mind being told how to feel and think.

It was no slip of the tongue when Lyndon B. Johnson famously said, “I’ll have those n*ggers voting Democratic for the next 200 years.” He knew what he was doing - building a future for his party ideologies by creating more government dependency (and solidarity among the sub-groups, particularly blacks). The Great Society legislation was largely about buying future votes - not necessarily improving the country. Dems have brilliantly kept their eye on that ball for 50+ years. Get elected. Get re-elected. And it turns out, most voters sell cheap. Eight years of a radical liberal ideologue like Obama should be sufficient proof of that.

And I wouldn't get too excited about the Senate moving to the right. That's a temporary situation. By the 2016 election, Dems will have refocused enough of the nation's attention on hating MIDDLE- AND UPPER-INCOME STRAIGHT WHITE CHRISTIAN MEN, they will likely retain the White House and retake the Senate. Let's face it, when it comes to manipulating popular public opinion, Republicans are amateurs. Sorry. It doesn't really matter if someone says, "Got'cha!" now. It's too late. Obamacare is here to stay. Checkmate America.

BUILD THREAD


'84 Hatch, Bracket Car, [email protected], but I'm working on it
'71 Mach One FB 351c, Slow
'73 Torino, 302, Slower


~

Last edited by Mike in Kentucky; November 19th, 2014 at 11:01 AM. Reason: badd speling
Mike in Kentucky is offline  
post #56 of 77 Old November 19th, 2014, 12:35 PM Thread Starter
7.62x39 CO2 Cannon
 
JohnC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: USA
Posts: 5,018
           
iTrader: 1 reviews
Gruber said this is a tax on people. Mostly union workers will get hit for up to 40% tax on their Cadillac HC plans.

This is a tax on the middle class as well. Years down the road, when all this shit kicks in, people are going to be PISSED!

---------- Post added at 12:12 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:10 PM ----------



---------- Post added at 01:35 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:12 PM ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike in Kentucky View Post
There are only two rules in politics:

1) Get Elected
2) Get Re-Elected

This has nothing to do with what is good or bad for America (or the health of Americans for that matter). This is about votes - it always has been. Dems have done a masterful job of dividing society into fallaciously marginalized sub-groups (based on gender, race, age, income, region, sexual orientation, education level, etc).

Each sub-group is methodically pulled aside to receive their prepackaged propaganda, convincing them that THEIR group is being oppressed by the national villain. Once that group is properly agitated, Dems simply point the finger at the same old bad guys ... MIDDLE- AND UPPER-INCOME STRAIGHT WHITE CHRISTIAN MEN. Every other slice of society is fair game for divisive liberal propaganda. Divide and conquer. It's a simple yet highly effective political strategy. We can't deny that it works. Sadly, most people don't really mind being told how to feel and think.

It was no slip of the tongue when Lyndon B. Johnson famously said, “I’ll have those n*ggers voting Democratic for the next 200 years.” He knew what he was doing - building a future for his party ideologies by creating more government dependency (and solidarity among the sub-groups, particularly blacks). The Great Society legislation was largely about buying future votes - not necessarily improving the country. Dems have brilliantly kept their eye on that ball for 50+ years. Get elected. Get re-elected. And it turns out, most voters sell cheap. Eight years of a radical liberal ideologue like Obama should be sufficient proof of that.

And I wouldn't get too excited about the Senate moving to the right. That's a temporary situation. By the 2016 election, Dems will have refocused enough of the nation's attention on hating MIDDLE- AND UPPER-INCOME STRAIGHT WHITE CHRISTIAN MEN, they will likely retain the White House and retake the Senate. Let's face it, when it comes to manipulating popular public opinion, Republicans are amateurs. Sorry. It doesn't really matter if someone says, "Got'cha!" now. It's too late. Obamacare is here to stay. Checkmate America.
The political elite and their cronies and oliharchs wouldn't have any other way.

They won't stop until they have a classess society of uneducated dumbed down peasants.

Folks like Eric Foxwell ans John/Nova are sold on the lies. No matter how much you show them shit like Gruber, exposing this crap, they ignore it and go right back to the talking points.

Just listen to Gruber. The success of this fucked up ACA was because they can get away with outright dishonesty and fudging the numbers because Americans are too stupid to see and understand they're being lied to.

2010 CGM Camaro 2SS RS 6L90
Stage II ProCharger D1X
760rwhp @ 14 PSI

JohnC is online now  
post #57 of 77 Old November 19th, 2014, 07:10 PM
He of Long Wind
 
Mike in Kentucky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Oil Springs, KY
Posts: 2,142
           
iTrader: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnC View Post
Folks like Eric Foxwell ans John/Nova are sold on the lies. No matter how much you show them shit like Gruber, exposing this crap, they ignore it and go right back to the talking points.

Just listen to Gruber. The success of this fucked up ACA was because they can get away with outright dishonesty and fudging the numbers because Americans are too stupid to see and understand they're being lied to.
Yeah, but I'm not so sure about the stupidity generalization. This kind of social engineering requires lots of NOISE - something we have a great supply in the modern media age. Fifty years ago, every town had 2 newspapers and 3 TV stations. It was much easier for average voters to get both sides of a story and then form an intelligent opinion.

Today, voters have to wade through endless expanses of screaming pundits, partisan journalism, special interest campaigns and social media commentary. There is no such thing as "straight reporting" today. Every story has an angle - every word crafted to distort, dissuade, or misdirect the reader/viewer. And it comes at us from every direction - day and night - until it blends into one big roar. So it's no surprise that many voters find it easier to just "pick a side" rather than try to decode the propaganda.

That doesn't mean the voters are stupid, it just means they can't hear themselves think.

BUILD THREAD


'84 Hatch, Bracket Car, [email protected], but I'm working on it
'71 Mach One FB 351c, Slow
'73 Torino, 302, Slower


~

Last edited by Mike in Kentucky; November 19th, 2014 at 10:51 PM.
Mike in Kentucky is offline  
post #58 of 77 Old November 20th, 2014, 12:52 AM
Pawsitively sexy
 
Sixpointslow's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Lower Sussex, DE
Posts: 10,561
                   
iTrader: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnC View Post
Gruber said this is a tax on people. Mostly union workers will get hit for up to 40% tax on their Cadillac HC plans.

This is a tax on the middle class as well. Years down the road, when all this shit kicks in, people are going to be PISSED!

---------- Post added at 12:12 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:10 PM ----------

GRUBER: "We all know it's really a tax on people." - YouTube

---------- Post added at 01:35 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:12 PM ----------



The political elite and their cronies and oliharchs wouldn't have any other way.

They won't stop until they have a classess society of uneducated dumbed down peasants.

Folks like Eric Foxwell ans John/Nova are sold on the lies. No matter how much you show them shit like Gruber, exposing this crap, they ignore it and go right back to the talking points.

Just listen to Gruber. The success of this fucked up ACA was because they can get away with outright dishonesty and fudging the numbers because Americans are too stupid to see and understand they're being lied to.
I didn't ignore it. I said that I agree with the notion that America has a significant amount of idiots for citizens. How can you expect good service when you the consumer are not the most important person? I hate the ACA too, Johnny boy. The difference between us is that I prefer it to what we had.

2012 CTS-V

Not stock


Sixpointslow is offline  
post #59 of 77 Old November 20th, 2014, 12:40 PM Thread Starter
7.62x39 CO2 Cannon
 
JohnC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: USA
Posts: 5,018
           
iTrader: 1 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sixpointslow View Post
The difference between us is that I prefer it to what we had.

And this is why America is going down. :

People are so damn hung up on political ideology of shit like socialism and socialized healthcare, that since this is a step in that direction, they're for it no matter how bad the law is and how negatively it impacts the working middle class folks who will be the most effected by the higher costs and reduced care.

2010 CGM Camaro 2SS RS 6L90
Stage II ProCharger D1X
760rwhp @ 14 PSI

JohnC is online now  
post #60 of 77 Old November 20th, 2014, 02:11 PM
Pawsitively sexy
 
Sixpointslow's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Lower Sussex, DE
Posts: 10,561
                   
iTrader: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnC View Post
And this is why America is going down. :

People are so damn hung up on political ideology of shit like socialism and socialized healthcare, that since this is a step in that direction, they're for it no matter how bad the law is and how negatively it impacts the working middle class folks who will be the most effected by the higher costs and reduced care.
It's not a step towards socialism, John. The ACA isn't socialism. It's private insurance. Maybe our real problem is education. If only people could understand basic priciples, perhaps they wouldn't have such misguided views. But hey, the right wing media doesn't care about education, so why would you?

2012 CTS-V

Not stock


Sixpointslow is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Forums at Modded Mustangs forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome