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Discussion Starter #1
2001 GT Auto
Mods: 4.56 full spool, 3500 stall converter, Bama tune, BBK CAI, mild weight reduction, MT Drag Radials

Best pass is
60 - 1.699
330 - 5.318
660 - [email protected]
990 - 11.026
1320 - [email protected]

I have had a best 60' of 1.669, but bad air kept it slower overall.

I am trying to figure out a way to get into the 12s without cutting up the car or dumping a bunch of money into it.

I want to know if something is wrong with the car or something...I keep getting told that my short numbers indicate I should be mid-low 12s and be closer to 105-108mph, I keep telling them that I have it set up right for launching and that the 4.6l 2v doesn't breathe well enough to make those numbers without a power adder.

I would love some insight/help!
 

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Doing some messing around on an et to hp calculator it seems that trap speed is about right for a mostly stock 2v. Doing some calculations with your numbers and assuming your stang weights about 3200 lbs, it shows hp between 260-280 hp. A better tune, 75mm tb, upper intake plenum and getting rid of your cats and full 2.5” exhaust will help a lot. What rpm and gear are you at when you cross the line?
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Doing some messing around on an et to hp calculator it seems that trap speed is about right for a mostly stock 2v. Doing some calculations with your numbers and assuming your stang weights about 3200 lbs, it shows hp between 260-280 hp. A better tune, 75mm tb, upper intake plenum and getting rid of your cats and full 2.5” exhaust will help a lot. What rpm and gear are you at when you cross the line?
3rd gear about 6100
 

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I would look at suspension upgrades. Get that 60' down some more, every .1 in the 60' is .2 at the big end.
 

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there's a video floating around on YouTube of a guys quest for 12's. only difference was that he had cams.. but he made it happen.

what wheels are those MT drags on? you could run 99/00 style wheels. they are lighter than the Bullitts. the v6 wheels are very light as well...


also your trap speed is where it should be for NA... cams might add 2-5 mph to it. a blower @9psi will get you in the 110-115 trap range..
 

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Doing some messing around on an et to hp calculator it seems that trap speed is about right for a mostly stock 2v. Doing some calculations with your numbers and assuming your stang weights about 3200 lbs, it shows hp between 260-280 hp. A better tune, 75mm tb, upper intake plenum and getting rid of your cats and full 2.5” exhaust will help a lot. What rpm and gear are you at when you cross the line?
3rd gear about 6100
In addition to what others said, what are your shift points set to? If all your shift points are north of 6k rpms that is part of the problem. A stock 2v doesnt make any power up there.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
In addition to what others said, what are your shift points set to? If all your shift points are north of 6k rpms that is part of the problem. A stock 2v doesnt make any power up there.
Ye,s shift point is about 6400

---------- Post added at 02:54 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:53 PM ----------

I would look at suspension upgrades. Get that 60' down some more, every .1 in the 60' is .2 at the big end.
60' won't come down anymore than that, not enough power

---------- Post added at 02:55 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:54 PM ----------

there's a video floating around on YouTube of a guys quest for 12's. only difference was that he had cams.. but he made it happen.

what wheels are those MT drags on? you could run 99/00 style wheels. they are lighter than the Bullitts. the v6 wheels are very light as well...


also your trap speed is where it should be for NA... cams might add 2-5 mph to it. a blower @9psi will get you in the 110-115 trap range..
I am using Jeg Stars for wheels
 

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jeg stars on all 4 wheels? skinnies in front?
 

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The 4.56 gear is killing the top end. You're right that the car doesn't have enough steam on the top end to keep pulling. Your 60' and 1/8 is great. This steep of a gear is meant for 1/8 mile racing. Shifting the stock motor at 6400rpm is to high. Your power starts falling off after 5600rpm. I'd say bring the shift points down to 6k.
 
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The 4.56 gear is killing the top end. You're right that the car doesn't have enough steam on the top end to keep pulling. Your 60' and 1/8 is great. This steep of a gear is meant for 1/8 mile racing. Shifting the stock motor at 6400rpm is to high. Your power starts falling off after 5600rpm. I'd say bring the shift points down to 6k.
Exactly

Op you will need to lower your shift points and go with a taller tire. Otherwise you will need to add cams and supporting mods and keep your setup as is. The problem is that if you lower your shift points with your setup untouched, you will lose et and will have to shift into 4th when crossing the line. You could swap out the 4.56s but your 60 ft will suffer. The bottom line is you will either have to at least add bolt ons to grow into the 4.56s or swap to a numerically lower gear and lower your shift points.
 

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Shifting a stock 2v at 6400 even though it's not making power is better than shifting at 6000 and dropping more power after the shift. Even with a stock car, I've always gone by the moto....if you shift under 6500 then you should let your husband drive. I'd actually raise the shift point to keep average power higher between shifts.

For the power, 4.56s are fine. And I doubt there is room to improve the 60'. A 1.6 is about all you're gonna get with that power and stock weight.

So....youre at the point of reading this and saying wtf.....have you at least done a j mod?
 

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Discussion Starter #13
My ultimate goal is 12's on a stock motor...I know the supporting mods, but not there yet...wife gave the ok to strip some more weight from the car, maybe that will get me there

---------- Post added at 10:37 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:36 AM ----------

Shifting a stock 2v at 6400 even though it's not making power is better than shifting at 6000 and dropping more power after the shift. Even with a stock car, I've always gone by the moto....if you shift under 6500 then you should let your husband drive. I'd actually raise the shift point to keep average power higher between shifts.

For the power, 4.56s are fine. And I doubt there is room to improve the 60'. A 1.6 is about all you're gonna get with that power and stock weight.

So....youre at the point of reading this and saying wtf.....have you at least done a j mod?
J-mod, no, stock trans other than converter
 

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Shifting a stock 2v at 6400 even though it's not making power is better than shifting at 6000 and dropping more power after the shift. Even with a stock car, I've always gone by the moto....if you shift under 6500 then you should let your husband drive. I'd actually raise the shift point to keep average power higher between shifts.

For the power, 4.56s are fine. And I doubt there is room to improve the 60'. A 1.6 is about all you're gonna get with that power and stock weight.

So....youre at the point of reading this and saying wtf.....have you at least done a j mod?
I agree to an extent but my whole thing is why delay the shift after power falls off to have less rpm in the next gear in your power band? These motors make good mid range and low end torque, when you shift higher you get into a higher rpm in the next gear where youre not making peak power. Im not saying shift at 5500rpms because thats where the powerband ends but if you delay the shift you spend more time outside your power band in a given gear and less time in the powerband in the next gear because youre shifting at a higher rpm. If the op had cams to utilize those extra few hundred rpms I can see it being worth it but imo its not in stock form. Play with the shift points and prove me wrong, this is all a theory but makes sense to me. Id like to know if it helps or hurts on a factory setup.
 

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Do a j mod and I would bet you would probably hit 12s. Shifting higher rpm even after the power curve dips down keeps a higher average power overall. I don't want to say midrange torque doesn't matter since hp is calculated based off torque....but midrange torque means nothing. Keep the highest average power, and you will go as fast as you can
 

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I don't see it mentioned but what is the elevation for track you race at?
 

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Maybe I can help. I got my auto 02 GT into the high 12's with bolt on's.
My best was 12.87 @ 106.50
I was running 4.30 gears on MT drag radials with a 3500 stall.
I dyno'd 262 hp with the following
Long tube headers, off road X pipe, Steeda catback (Borla)
Steeda underdrive pullies,
C&L plenum
Front sway bar removed
Upper and lower control arms
Tokiko drag struts
Weld racing wheels (front & back) 15" VW tires (cheap radial skinnies)
Tuned by Ken Bjonnes

Your trap speed seems really low. I trapped 104-108 after Ken tuned it. He had my convertor locking pretty quickly after the shifts and you could feel it pull much better at the top end after the tune. With a mild cam I could have gone 12.60's.
 
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I pulled my dyno sheets from back when I was racing the car n/a and it made 245 hp and 280 torque.
With the MT's and 4.30 gears I was just running out of steam going through the traps. Your gears might be a little too steep without adding some power and extending the power band. What was said above is all correct about your power dropping off after 6,000 rpm. mine held at 230-231 until 6,200 then started dropping off slowly. Also the statement on shift points is true. My tune was set up to drop down to 4,300-4,400 which kept me in my power band after each shift. I wanna say my shift point was around 64-6,500. You might get there with just a re tune. When I had mine done we dyno'd it then road tested and corrected the shift points and convertor lock up schedule. Adding long tubes really helped extend my power band and the car pulled much better at the top end. I went from trapping 101-102 to 104-108 after the headers. I had a buddy who ran almost the exact same set up at the time who ran 12.90's with 4.10 gears. His was a PI head swapped 98 auto.
 
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Keep the highest average power, and you will go as fast as you can
This is 100% accurate.

Which is why anything over 5600-5900 is a waste on a stock HCI 2-valve and will result in lower ETs and traps. 5600-5900 is where the HP curves of subsequent gears cross on that car. Anything more or less is leaving power on the table.

OP, as someone finally mentioned a couple comments back, what is your DA? If your profile location of Glendale AZ is correct, then your DA is likely pretty high, and your times very well could be faster than expected.
 

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Discussion Starter #20
I don't see it mentioned but what is the elevation for track you race at?
I race at Wild Horse Pass, elevation is 1145FT, but Corrected DA for the 13.28 was hovering about 3000ft which is good air there, usually it hovers about 4000ft...I know the air isn't the best, but it is what I have to live with...

---------- Post added at 08:23 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:21 AM ----------

I don't see it mentioned but what is the elevation for track you race at?
I pulled my dyno sheets from back when I was racing the car n/a and it made 245 hp and 280 torque.
With the MT's and 4.30 gears I was just running out of steam going through the traps. Your gears might be a little too steep without adding some power and extending the power band. What was said above is all correct about your power dropping off after 6,000 rpm. mine held at 230-231 until 6,200 then started dropping off slowly. Also the statement on shift points is true. My tune was set up to drop down to 4,300-4,400 which kept me in my power band after each shift. I wanna say my shift point was around 64-6,500. You might get there with just a re tune. When I had mine done we dyno'd it then road tested and corrected the shift points and convertor lock up schedule. Adding long tubes really helped extend my power band and the car pulled much better at the top end. I went from trapping 101-102 to 104-108 after the headers. I had a buddy who ran almost the exact same set up at the time who ran 12.90's with 4.10 gears. His was a PI head swapped 98 auto.
As for me having 4.56 gears, it was $600 for the whole rear, brakes and everything, couldn't pass it up...I may go to 4.30's but ultimately I can't spend $500 on a tune as I was quoted for the guy that does good tunes for New Edge's around here...I am looking for a set of long tubes, but again cost is an issue right now

---------- Post added at 08:25 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:23 AM ----------

This is 100% accurate.

Which is why anything over 5600-5900 is a waste on a stock HCI 2-valve and will result in lower ETs and traps. 5600-5900 is where the HP curves of subsequent gears cross on that car. Anything more or less is leaving power on the table.

OP, as someone finally mentioned a couple comments back, what is your DA? If your profile location of Glendale AZ is correct, then your DA is likely pretty high, and your times very well could be faster than expected.
Once I can get back out I will play with my shift points, but last time I made any changes to the car through the tune it slowed down, but I didn't change the shift points, I'll see what I can do with my handheld!
 
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