2V to 4V

5408 Views 120 Replies 12 Participants Last post by norcalam2, Dec 23, 2009

MikeJones

Discussion Starter · Dec 16, 2009

So I am not too sure about these motors. I know that 4v are better then 2v. im planning on doing a kb'd 4v. and i was wondering what it would take to turn my engine into a 4v? i know that i'll need new headers and kb replace the intake. and i'm gonna forge the bottom. rough estimate of power will be 700. at the most. maybe a little nitrous we'll see. I'm thinking 03-04 heads.

I'm just planning for the future.

81 - 100 of 121 Posts

norcalam2

· #81 · Dec 19, 2009

The 2010 camaro is brand new and we know it sucks ass! Lol! Can of worms....you have been opened.

Anyways I've seen dohc 32 valve heads flowing in the 350-400cfm range. But the discussion seems to have started with someone saying these new trickflows will make 4V's obsolete. Which will never happen. I don't care if they haven't gotten cam profiles down and all that other BS. 4V is better than 2V. And we haven't even begun to discuss the higher rev thresholds of the 4V or the fact that god himself came down to earth to create the 4V.

Ke^in

· #82 · Dec 19, 2009 (Edited)

norcalam2 said:
"think I'm going with Fox Lake 3V heads (flowing 272)" -taken from your bible, err, thread

Bible? What kind of exaggeration is that. And there is always someone that has already made his mind up. These heads are the best 2v heads period.

Ke^in

· #83 · Dec 19, 2009 (Edited)

norcalam2 said:
+1

Who needs to do their homework???

No one ever said, including me, that I had any knowledge of what 4v do. I haven't made any claims other than 1. They flow as good 2. they are lighter than 4v AND 3v. While many others here have made statements against the 2v heads without knowing anything about them.

mustang_gtr_99 said:
It seems like the only people who get exited over these heads are the N/A guys. Have fun with that, I will change the pulley and swap the tune to produce those gains.

Well of course N/A guys want them. Having said that they are putting out a FI version that will be even more kick-ass. LOADS of FI guys waiting for em.

Ke^in

· #84 · Dec 19, 2009

Safi said:
Well if your questions are already answered, then whats the problem with letting these guys continue with whatever they are discussing instead of making another thread over the same thing? :dunno

For some reason these 2v heads are upsetting Mustang owners? Why I would have no idea. You'd think being able to pull 80+ hp out of a stock NewEdge by just replacing the heads would be something that would EXCITE people. Well it does most people from the threads I've read. This is the exception. You'd think we were talking to fbody owners in denial.

Ke^in

· #85 · Dec 19, 2009 (Edited)

norcalam2 said:
But the discussion seems to have started with someone saying these new trickflows will make 4V's obsolete.

Who said that?

4V is better than 2V.

Because until now, they could flow more air than 2v which = more HP.

Again, a 2v with the head swap is outperforming a 4v 03/04 Mach1 stock.

No, these wont replace 4v, but anyone with them wont be missing those extra 2 valves nearly as much. It puts the 2v/4v cars in a more even field.

BTW

LsWht? said:
Well I have stg3 ported TFS 2v heads, and of course everything else in the book.

But I think it'll be a good motor you guys can begin to put in perspective of what a N/A 2v mod motor is capable of, but without losing it's drivablity.

03_StangGuy

· #86 · Dec 19, 2009

norcalam2 said:
The 2010 camaro is brand new and we know it sucks ass! Lol! Can of worms....you have been opened.

Anyways I've seen dohc 32 valve heads flowing in the 350-400cfm range. But the discussion seems to have started with someone saying these new trickflows will make 4V's obsolete. Which will never happen. I don't care if they haven't gotten cam profiles down and all that other BS. 4V is better than 2V. And we haven't even begun to discuss the higher rev thresholds of the 4V or the fact that god himself came down to earth to create the 4V.

I dont know who said the 4vs will be obsolete, But like Kevin said they will bring the 2vs up to a level damn close to the 4vs.

Boostang

· #87 · Dec 19, 2009

:no

norcalam2

· #88 · Dec 19, 2009

Holy sensitive....

Didn't mean to make you pee on your tampon string guys...

norcalam2

· #89 · Dec 19, 2009

Oh and both of you pseudo TF representatives have been arguing all along that these new heads and their non existent FI counterparts will outflow the 4V's. Aswell as saying that it's not worth going 4V with these new metal orgasms you guys are losing your shiz over.

And I like how you guys went through and re-read the thread and had a rebuttal for everything.......except RPM...

Don't touch that guys, just try to ignore it, it's cool.

LGHTNG02GT

· #90 · Dec 19, 2009

anybody have any idea how much the TF heads cost ??? :dunno

norcalam2

· #91 · Dec 20, 2009

LGHTNG02GT said:
anybody have any idea how much the TF heads cost ??? :dunno

Dude you can't put a price on gods work!

:tomato

LGHTNG02GT

· #92 · Dec 20, 2009

haha, nice. but they did with the 03/04 cobra's

i am thinking of keeping my hurt 2v around when i pull it and possibly build it in the future. maybe. but who knows ???

norcalam2

· #93 · Dec 20, 2009

well you can't put 4v swap coming soon in your sig and not do it... lol!

Ke^in

· #94 · Dec 20, 2009

03_StangGuy said:
I dont know who said the 4vs will be obsolete, But like Kevin said they will bring the 2vs up to a level damn close to the 4vs.

Nobody did. In this thread anyhow.

norcalam2 said:
Holy sensitive....

Didn't mean to make you pee on your tampon string guys...

Um, you are the one that got all bent out of shape about it, and acting all defensive. Not us. We were just stating the facts. *shrug*

No need to project.

LGHTNG02GT said:
anybody have any idea how much the TF heads cost ??? :dunno

$1,999.

norcalam2 said:
well you can't put 4v swap coming soon in your sig and not do it... lol!

Sure he can.

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LGHTNG02GT

· #95 · Dec 20, 2009

norcalam2 said:
well you can't put 4v swap coming soon in your sig and not do it... lol!

oh im deff still doing the 4v swap. thats without a doubt. i just havnt decided what to do with my 2v yet. i thought about selling off pieces of it, i thought about keeping it and building it. its a toss-up yet.

norcalam2

· #96 · Dec 20, 2009

Ke^in said:
Um, you are the one that got all bent out of shape about it, and acting all defensive. Not us. We were just stating the facts. *shrug*

No need to project.

Selective reading much???

limited

· #97 · Dec 20, 2009

My sig. used to say 5.0 teksid 2v in process,since I want to upgrade to a larger KB I am leaning toward 4v(the look alone is almost worth it) but the single cam of the 3v is enticing...what to do....what to do.

norcalam2

· #98 · Dec 20, 2009

Ya I'm liking the 3v more and more. With a good pnp these heads can flow some high numbers.

Plus as I may be coming back to CA in the future a teksid is out of the question aswell as any truck motors. So the 3v I should be able to get Bar'd.

Ke^in

· #99 · Dec 20, 2009 (Edited)

norcalam2 said:
Selective reading much???

Generic baseless comments much?

Again, I don't know why you are being so defensive against these heads. *shrug*

<edit>

Here is a link to the twisted wedge install. They gained 100+ with just these and the usual 2v boltons. They gained over 30hp with the SAME setup with fully ported P.I. heads. I can just imagine what numbers people are getting with a full ported set of these heads, and a full set of bolt ons as well.

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/3541660/TwistedWedge.pdf

As far as charts go.. HP 390.2 TRQ 373.4

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dcook_14

· #100 · Dec 21, 2009

Well my internet was garbage this weekend, so I'm going to do a DCook signiture 'quote everything you want to reply to' post.

03_StangGuy said:
Im not saying 4Vs arent a great design they are, But how much remove is there to improve with a port? I dont see much talk about 4v guys porting heads, maybe Ive just missed it.

There is a lot of room to port. It's a cast head, not a performance based aftermarket head. And you don't see the 4v guys porting because they already flow great numbers :dunno

mustang_gtr_99 said:
Right, I am not saying that they didnt do a great job however, it doesnt make sense to stay 2V if you are going to swap heads? Just my $0.02

$2000 for aftermarket TW heads vs. about $500 to do a 4v swap... Doesnt make much sense to me either.

03_StangGuy said:
Trick flow themselves said they were comin out with another version for more power so there has to be room left to grow.

Norcal, you said that TF must port them to get the better number when in fact its a totally redesigned head. Sounds like your missing some facts. On top of the power gains the average MPG with these have was around 24 mpg, lot better than the usual 18-20

The new version they are coming out with aren't going to be for more power, they are going to be more FI friendly. The current production TW heads raise the compression level to a point where FI would be dangerous. The higher compression probably has something to do with the better fuel economy too.

Ke^in said:
I don't know why the total all out "denial" about these heads are. Either people are so used to 4v people SO MUCH BETTER than 2v that they can't comprehend any different. OR people with 4v engines don't want to admit that maybe just maybe a 2v head can flow just as good?

I don't think anybody can deny that the $2000 highly engineered performance based TW heads flow as well as a STOCK 4v head. Trickflow did a great job with these heads, but they are 2v heads. The stuff you quoted from Ken from that "Get in line thread" even said that there is a limitation to how much volume can flow through a 2v head. I highlighted it below.

I think the real question is not which one is better, the question should be which one is a more sensible swap. For the money, I'm going with 4v

norcalam2 said:
"I'm sure there is. Some playing needs to be done. Trickflow hasn't even tried to port them yet. Obviously you can only flow so much air through 1 valve at a certain size, but I'm sure there are improvements to be made."

mustang_gtr_99 said:
It seems like the only people who get exited over these heads are the N/A guys. Have fun with that, I will change the pulley and swap the tune to produce those gains.

Haha, that's exactly what I was thinking. If you're wanting to build a sweet N/A car, then the TW heads might be a good decision. But I'm more concerned about hp, so I'm going 4v.

03_StangGuy said:
I dont know who said the 4vs will be obsolete, But like Kevin said they will bring the 2vs up to a level damn close to the 4vs.

Again, all that work and money to make them flow damn close to a stock 4v... Is it worth it?

Okay, I've said my piece. I'm not bashing the TW heads at all. They are a great head and have their place. But IMHO the 4v just make a lot more sense if you're going to swap heads. The only advantage I see from a TW head is that it'll weigh a little less than a 4v head. But with the money you save doing a 4v swap, you can buy a tubular k / coilover setup and cut that weight.

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