Modded Mustang Forums banner

41 - 60 of 155 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,184 Posts
Discussion Starter #41
I know there are some cost involved but leo's should have audio equipped cameras on them that they themselves cannot turn off. That way ALL situattions are documented visual and verbal none of the this was said or done when it can be seen and heard by various parties. And I will say again its damn good that sme ppl take the time out to pull out a camera and document thes situations bc if not then there is no telling how some of these situations would swing just based off of ones fabricated statements to cover ones ass.

Corey has stated what Should happen in this case but Wicked does have a damn good point. Even with the video one will have to sit back and let this all play out over time to see the final outcome. I don't like to make the comparison really but I know that even in awar zone they always instructed us that the presence of a weapon isn't enough of a threat to shoot someone we couldn't fire until fired upon. I suppose policeman have diff rules when it comes to that and even on the ground one uses a judgement call if someone has a gun andthe intentions are as clear as day.

This is all a sad situation though and should be in a way eye opening bc if the camera wasn't there... and in many situations there are no cameras just a story!
 

·
The Boss is in
Joined
·
23,756 Posts
The cop's wife is 8 months pregnant. The PD is carrying her health insurance, which I think is the right thing to do.
I agree. It's not like she made him do it nor is it any fault of her own. Wife and baby should not have to suffer due to his utter disregard for human life.

---------- Post added at 07:31 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:29 PM ----------

I know there are some cost involved but leo's should have audio equipped cameras on them that they themselves cannot turn off. That way ALL situattions are documented visual and verbal none of the this was said or done when it can be seen and heard by various parties. And I will say again its damn good that sme ppl take the time out to pull out a camera and document thes situations bc if not then there is no telling how some of these situations would swing just based off of ones fabricated statements to cover ones ass.

Corey has stated what Should happen in this case but Wicked does have a damn good point. Even with the video one will have to sit back and let this all play out over time to see the final outcome. I don't like to make the comparison really but I know that even in awar zone they always instructed us that the presence of a weapon isn't enough of a threat to shoot someone we couldn't fire until fired upon. I suppose policeman have diff rules when it comes to that and even on the ground one uses a judgement call if someone has a gun andthe intentions are as clear as day.

This is all a sad situation though and should be in a way eye opening bc if the camera wasn't there... and in many situations there are no cameras just a story!
Agreed, but I think many Soldiers, Marines, and other combat troops would argue that the ROE's that mandated you only shoot when shot upon let a lot of bad guys go, and got a lot of our guys killed. Those ROE's have come under fire on more than one occasion (no pun intended).
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,462 Posts
We will have to see. I do see this officer doing a significant jail stay but on the flip side I think he will see the outside again. I'm still hung up on the allegations that he planted the Taser near the body, that is just ****ed up. I don't think he went out looking to murder somebody but he made a life changing decision. You can still see the Taser probes attached to the guy he shot. There was a foot chase and struggle, it is not like he walked up and shot a random person. The best thing for him to do when he realized he ****ed up was to immediately render first aid, and to have never touched that Taser after it originally fell. He should have admitted that he ****ed up.

I have had contact with a few killers in my day. This guy just doesn't fit the mold. He had two complaints filed within 5 years which is nothing major. One was for deploying his Taser.

I by no means will defend the man shot. Like I said I do feel bad for him, but he actively chose to run and fight with the police. Like I have said on here time and time and time again, submit to arrest and handle any issues in court. If this guy did just that he would still be alive, and so wouldn't Eric Garner. The mentality being preached by a lot of idiots is buck the system. While you may not get killed and there are in totality only a small amount of deaths during police contacts if you look at the whole picture, why roll the ****ing dice? Pretty stupid in my mind.
 

·
'Murica
Joined
·
4,545 Posts
It is hard to watch. Just knowing he was dropped while running at no danger to that officer is sad.

Police go through a lot of dangerous and challenging situations. In this case, no way was that shooting justified.
 

·
The Boss is in
Joined
·
23,756 Posts
Exactly. No doubt he was flat out stupid for running.

Heres how I think it went down. I think he stopped him, they may have argued a little bit, maybe one or both of them were a bit of a hot head. I think the were maybe talking and the guy tried to take off and he tased him. Bucked the taser and took off again. The cop had a split second to think of what to do and for some reason he chose to shoot him. Maybe he wasn't in his right frame of mind, who really knows. Either way I think at that point he knew he was ****ed, so he for some dumb reason tried to plant the taser on him.

Either way, its all screwed up and he should do significant jail time for sure.

How murder works though is they a lot of times have to prove he was out to kill that guy, that his intent was to end his life. I don't think they will be able to prove that whether it is true or not. I think the defense will argue what I said. He had a split second to react and he was in fear for his life, wadda wadda wadda. Either way, it will get plead down to manslaughter for sure. I would be completely floored if he was convicted of murder. Not saying that he shouldn't be charged with murder, but just saying that is what will probably be the case.

Its kind of the same concept as one guy beating up another and the guy that got beat up died. That person is never convicted of murder usually because their intent was not to actually murder them. It normally gets plead down the negligent homicide or manslaughter, or even 2nd degree murder. Either way, he will definitely see the outside again.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,462 Posts
I'm trying to put myself in this officer's shoes for a moment. I just can't fathom he purposely going out to murder this man. I have been there on the street with my wife at home pregnant and believe me losing my job was the last thing on my mind.

With five years on the job this guy is getting close to veteran status. He also has Corporal or Patrolman First Class stripes on his shoulder so he should know the in's and out's of the job. This situation shouldn't have been the first one he has seen like this. He was also a military veteran oddly enough both he and the victim served in the Coast Guard.

One of the main things you need to harness in Police work is the Adrenaline dump. You need to use that dump to get through a stressful and dangerous situation but you also need to be able to bring yourself back down, and quickly. No doubt this officer had a dump, but once the man broke free he should have re assessed what was happening. Instead he made a horrible decision and shot, when he had other options and back up arriving promptly. An adrenaline dump will do messed up things to your body and thought process. You want to win the fight.

Whether or not the officer could control that dump is not the the victims fault and it is a homicide any way you cut it. The officer should have reacted to his training and use of force laws. Training is universal throughout most PD's and there are very limited circumstances where you can use deadly force on a fleeing suspect. This would not be one.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,184 Posts
Discussion Starter #47
[/COLOR]
Agreed, but I think many Soldiers, Marines, and other combat troops would argue that the ROE's that mandated you only shoot when shot upon let a lot of bad guys go, and got a lot of our guys killed. Those ROE's have come under fire on more than one occasion (no pun intended).

Spot on, that's why I said when on the ground and they have a gun and the intentions are as clear as day then use that judgement call. You may just face some music later.
 

·
'Murica
Joined
·
4,545 Posts
foxfive;10326938I said:
If this guy did just that he would still be alive, and so wouldn't Eric Garner. The mentality being preached by a lot of idiots is buck the system. While you may not get killed and there are in totality only a small amount of deaths during police contacts if you look at the whole picture, why roll the ****ing dice? Pretty stupid in my mind.
I know you are an officer and I respect what you do. Here is what I see.

The guy made a bad decision to run, no doubt, but not aggressive towards the officer. The officer ended his life.

There is no way this isn't murder. Imagine if anyone of us got pulled over and ran, then shot while driving away. It isn't how people learn to respect and trust the police.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,462 Posts
I agree it is a homicide, but the victim played a significant roll in his own death is all I'm saying. In my experience Officers just don't use a Taser on a daily basis. I have carried a Taser since 2005-2006 and have never deployed it. I'm active and am always in the **** but normally when people resist I have already been hands on and didn't have to disengage to take them into custody. I have drawn the Taser a few times and the bad guy backs right down.

This guy had probes still in him, and he was fighting to get free. Should he have been shot in this circumstance, absolutely not. But he wasn't an innocent bystander either.

These cases give police a bad name on a whole. Do you know how many arrests were made in this country just while I was typing this sentence? It would be like not trusting air travel because a commercial jet crashes.
 

·
The Boss is in
Joined
·
23,756 Posts
Exactly. Hes not saying he had any right to shoot him, but had he not run he would still be here today. Paid a child support payment and went on his way.

Either way, neither party was in the right, and it was definitely a flat out murder.
 

·
The Boss is in
Joined
·
23,756 Posts
Yup. I like living up here in Michigan too. None of that stuff.

There is so many twisted articles about this. Was he shot because of his race? Who knows, maybe. But to straight up come to that conclusion right away with zero evidence is not helping anyone. He could very well have done it to a white guy too had he done the exact same thing, we will never know. And to keep twisting all of these things into racial outcries is not helping anything.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,184 Posts
Discussion Starter #53
And I'm so tired of ALL the blacks rising up and twisting things. I'm so happy I live in the North. None of that BS here,
That's one large brush you just used to paint with.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,462 Posts
I guess I should have been more clear and not said, "blacks" and used the word Protesters. Primarily I see black Protesters and the white you see to me appear to be idiots feeding off the #blacklivesmatter BS. I am somewhat sheltered I guess, where I'm from there is little to no racial tension. Blacks around here aren't scared of the police and nobody gives them ****. I have never had any racial.profiling comments made. In fact I had a pretty unfriendly discussion with the local Walmart about having there loss prevention follow around a black couple for no reason while they shopped. The couple came into the PD to have me look into it. Nice couple that now lives down the street from me. In the North Country if anything black people are looked after and respected by the police.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,184 Posts
Discussion Starter #55
I guess I should have been more clear and not said, "blacks" and used the word Protesters. I am somewhat sheltered I guess, where I'm from there is little to no racial tension. Blacks around here aren't scared of the police and nobody gives them ****.
I don't really want to take this thread there but I personally can't say that. I have met ppl from the north and west coast that say they have never experienced that stuff though and some say they never experienced it until visiting or being stationed in the south. My ex wife is just one example of that.

So depending on one grows up they could have had a opposite life experince with the police and racial tensions esp dealing with some of the smaller towns in the south. So I feel where you are coming from but some other ppl are coming from different experiences and walks in life. I just TRY to take it all into consideration.
 

·
The Boss is in
Joined
·
23,756 Posts
We aren't discounting things anyone has gone through, nor saying it doesnt happen, Just simply saying that we are glad we live in a place where more or less, there is no racial tension. Everyone lives together just fine.

Its the same way where I live. Im sure its probably different in Detroit, but I live 4 hours from there and besides the Tigers, I dont like Detroit lol.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,462 Posts
That is one thing I don't always do. I forget that people come from different areas sometimes and go by what I know. My Dad was a cop in Hartford CT in the 70's. The place was a shithole and he was involved in 3 shootings. He wasn't racist at all even though he dealt with a lot of non white criminals. He never preached that **** although I do remember him using the term Puerto Rican fence climbers for the pointy shoes some bad guys used or Porch Monkey(all races) for the dirt bags that hang out drinking on the stoops. But he wasn't racist. I remember him coming to visit me in college and a black guys car stalled out. We got out and pushed him so he could jump start it. He had many black friends and advanced the careers of many minority employees when he was Chief of Police in Massachusetts. Race issues were never a thing for me. My wife is Puerto Rican. You really don't see it around me, balcks and minorities don't walk around scared of the police. Even go to a big city like Boston the majority of the population likes the police, they respect them.

In the North the copblockers and free staters are the issue. And those ****ers are infiltrating local and state government so stand the **** by.....they are the racists.
 

·
The Boss is in
Joined
·
23,756 Posts
Your dad not only owned a Le'Car, but he autocrossed it, and bought your mother a Le' Bag to match. As far as I am concerned hes earned a pardon for anything he has ever done.
 
41 - 60 of 155 Posts
Top