Modded Mustang Forums banner
Cancel
Create thread New Garage Forums

Head Gasket, maybe bad rings...

Jump to Latest
1 - 20 of 51 Posts

Real98Roush

· Registered
Joined
·
151 Posts
Discussion starter · #1 ·
Since I had my motor rebuilt last year this time, it has consumed oil. Use RP 5w30. About a half quart every other full tank of gas. Always ran strong, Shelby tuned, & they gave it their blessing as a strong motor.

Rebuilt with stock crank, forged rods & pistons. Comp Cams in stock NPI heads.

Anyways, recently I've been getting a lot of smoke on startup. Figured it might just be the weather. I had side exhaust so it's really obvious that the right side is smoking 3x-5x more than the left, so it caught my attention & now I'm wondering if I have reason for concern.

At startup yesterday, I got out to see what's up & noticed the exhaust tips were soaked & there was water spatter on the ground. Smoke & water more prominent on the right side. So today when I walked up I looked in both pipe & couldn't see or feel any condensation. Couple seconds after startup she started dumped smoke. Got out, same deal with the spatter.

Car seems to be running strong as ever. Haven't really got on it I the past few days but general acceleration through 3000-3500rpm is all good. What do you think?

Oh I forgot to mention the recent coolant consumption as well. Doesn't appear to be mixing fluids at all. Just consuming em...

Piston rings, head gasket, to hard to say? You tell me
 
#2 ·
I remember you talking about this. I would check the head gaskets and do compression tests. Could be your valve seals too. Who did the machine work? I would take it back there and explain what's happening.

Also idk but maybe running heavier oil will help, but I don't know enough about those engines to recommend that.
 
#4 ·
I assume that there are no visible oil or coolant leaks? What cold and hot idle oil pressures are you seeing? Does the exhaust have any form of crossover, or is it "true" or "divorced" duals? Have you tested for presence of combustion gases in the coolant? How much coolant is it losing, and how many miles are you driving in that period of time?

A leak-down test would be the place to start, IMO. It will supply you with more pertinent information than a compression test in this scenario.
 
Discussion starter · #6 ·
No visible coolant or oil leaks

Oil pressure seems unchanged. (Only have OEM dash gauge - which doesn't give true oil pressure from what I've heard. Only pressure or no pressure). Clarification needed, but the gauge stands straight up from startup through warm up (same as always)

Crossover present. Smoke & wetness on both sides just more noticeable on the right side. (Custom H pipe)

Have NOT tested coolant for contamination

Coolant overflow half empty after 100-150 miles (twice a week). Smoke noted from oil fill & bubbles seen in coolant. Very small bubbles at idle with overflow cap removed.

Motor rebuild completed last April ~5,000 miles ago

Went to shop this morning, the owner seemed to shrug it off as condensation. I didn't accept that answer & made an appt for tomorrow morning.

What tests should I have performed?

Coolant pressurization test?

Leak down?

Compression?
 
#7 ·
I'd pursue a leak down test first, as that will not only identify which hole(s) is the source of the problem, but also where it is leaking at. From your answers it does sound like you may have a headgasket leak.

I'd also suggest installing a real oil pressure gauge. The factory gauge uses a pressure switch rather than a sending unit. Anything above 6 psi closes the switch and places the needle in the middle of the gauge.
 
Discussion starter · #8 ·
Appreciate the input. I will report back tomorrow after testing is complete.

The shop provided 1 year warranty, but this guy will try to get out of it based on previous experience & his comments that it's normal to smoke & consume fluids.

Is there anyway he could try to point the finger at me & not stand by his work? The car has never overheated. The OEM gauge has never went further then straight up.

I should mention, he initially was against putting cams in. Stated all warranty related issues that could be caused by the cams wouldn't be honored & I wouldn't be surprised if this comes up.

If there's any reason you think this could be related let me know & if you know there's no possible way the comp XE270AH cams could cause this please explain with details so I can be better educated for this potential argument. Thanks again for all input
 
#9 ·
I agree, a leak down test should be the first step. Cylinder leakage is a much more reliable way of detecting a problem than a compression test. If you have a blown head gasket, damaged rings, piston, valve guide/seal/seat issue the leak down test will find it.

I highly doubt the cams would be the cause of your issues. There just isn't a logical reason for that IMO.

If you can get your hands on a bore scope that may help as well.
 
Save
Reply Quote Like Like
#11 ·
Real98Roush said:
Is there anyway he could try to point the finger at me & not stand by his work? The car has never overheated. The OEM gauge has never went further then straight up.
Click to expand...
If it is a headgasket leak, it's impossible to accurately state the cause until teardown and inspection. Detonation will kill headgaskets, but it would be obvious upon teardown.
 
#12 ·
I noticed something in your thread at Corral that you neglected to mention here:

real98ROUSH said:
They bored the block .050 (discovered it had been rebuilt already)...
Click to expand...
That's excessive. I'd still proceed with a leak down test to identify the hole(s) and where it is leaking at, but with the current facts presented, I'd suggest making plans for another mode of transportation for awhile. That block should not have been used in the first place, IMO.
 
Discussion starter · #15 ·
My bad, I tried to list everything. Yes, it's bored .050.

Went there this morning & the owner would NOT let me wait. I'm really uncomfortable with this, but I'm gonna give him a chance to stand by his word/work.

Dropping it off tomorrow. Unfortunately, the other mustang I had was crashed & I just sold my bros car Saturday(went to USAF) so I don't have another car.

Will report findings tomorrow...
 
Discussion starter · #16 ·
I've never been the type to sue or anything like that, but I may have to consider some kind of action...

Dropped the car off this morning. Made absolutely clear that this is a warranty check & there should be no charge. He agreed, but said chromoly rings were used & sometimes don't seat properly but "they would make them seat". For clarification I said this would be covered by warranty. To which he replied "no, there is no warranty on a high performance motor". I mentioned that the car was dyno tuned by Shelby & only laid down 196HP & that isn't "high performance" in any regard. He quit making eye contact & shrugged it off...

I also told him that he was NOT to put anything in the oil or coolant (i.e. Any kind of stop leak products) & he agreed.

He let me borrow the shop truck to go to work, so I'm at work waiting for them to call & report findings.

Man, this is really starting to get me aggravated. Will report back with findings after he calls.
 
#17 ·
Real98Roush said:
I've never been the type to sue or anything like that, but I may have to consider some kind of action...

Dropped the car off this morning. Made absolutely clear that this is a warranty check & there should be no charge. He agreed, but said chromoly rings were used & sometimes don't seat properly but "they would make them seat". For clarification I said this would be covered by warranty. To which he replied "no, there is no warranty on a high performance motor". I mentioned that the car was dyno tuned by Shelby & only laid down 196HP & that isn't "high performance" in any regard. He quit making eye contact & shrugged it off...

I also told him that he was NOT to put anything in the oil or coolant (i.e. Any kind of stop leak products) & he agreed.

He let me borrow the shop truck to go to work, so I'm at work waiting for them to call & report findings.

Man, this is really starting to get me aggravated. Will report back with findings after he calls.
Click to expand...
Completely irrelevant but is that really all the car put down?
 
#18 ·
Real98Roush said:
He agreed, but said chromoly rings were used & sometimes don't seat properly but "they would make them seat".
Click to expand...
In other words, they'll take the car out and beat on it. Which, by the way, will not do a thing for ring seal at this point.

Is a leakdown test part of the plan today?
 
#19 ·
Lol after a year they're going to "make the rings seat?" Like tang said, not going to happen at this point and I'll wager it's more than just rings needing to seat. Definitely demand a leak down test. This place is starting to sound like a mustang shop I used to use and got hosed by....
 
Discussion starter · #20 ·
Yes, 196 rwhp.

PI intake swap, exhaust, & bolt ons bumped it up to 270rwhp.

I did the swap in my garage after I got the car back & was disappointed with the power level (or lack of!)

By the way, he promised 400hp & to have it done in 2 weeks. Took almost 11 weeks & had less than half of the power he quoted. He actually called me one day & asked "400 hp, you sure that'll be enough". LOL

I NEVER complained about the time it was taking, told him just do it right & I did't care how long it takes at this point (month after the car was supposed to be ready). NEVER hassled him about the power level, I just moved on. I feel I have been pretty lenient with him, but if he doesn't make this right, I will not be so pleasant moving forward.

Have a plan in place now, but don't feel it's acceptable to share at this point. I want him to have the opportunity to make this right before I flame throw his ass! Thanks again for all the input

Any comments on the use & seating issues of the chromoly piston rings? I'm not sure if he's BS'n me or if it's common for chromoly rings to seat incorrectly (if they have been seated improperly, what's the correct way to fix them?)
 
1 - 20 of 51 Posts
About this Discussion
50 Replies
8 Participants
Last post:
xandraxal
Modded Mustang Forums
posts
6.3M
members
83K
Since
2005
A forum community dedicated to all Ford Mustang owners and enthusiasts. Come join the discussion about performance, racing, builds, modifications, troubleshooting, maintenance, and more!
Full Forum Listing
Explore Our Forums
96 - 04 Modular Mustangs 5.0 Mustangs New Members Introductions Classic Mustangs